Timing of Spin Modifier in Carrara 6

hrpschrdhrpschrd Posts: 52
edited May 2012 in Carrara Discussion

I am using the Modifier of Spin but it can't be stopped! I'm in the Assemble room and the objects spin just fine for the whole Sequencer length of 20 seconds but I can't stop the spin in 15 seconds (or any time). Changing the setting in the Modifiers tab doesn't work. Bug, or is there a way to add the Modifiers to the Sequencer that I have not found in the Manual?


Thanks in advance for the help.

Post edited by hrpschrd on

Comments

  • 3DAGE3DAGE Posts: 2,025
    edited December 1969

    Hi Hrpschrd :)

    working fine here in 8.1.12 and the 8.5 beta
    Make sure you hit enter (return) or click the UI somewhere else, to set the stop time.

    spin_settings.jpg
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  • hrpschrdhrpschrd Posts: 52
    edited December 1969

    Thanks 3DAGE.

    Now another question about Spin. It seems that having set an object spinning, I can not further alter it in the Sequencer except for translation. I want a more complex motion of spinning in more than one axis. I tried adding another spin in a different axis and the last spin was the only spin (the first spin was lost). Is this just a limit of the program? Do I need to manipulate the object in three axes over time?

    hrpschrd

  • hrpschrdhrpschrd Posts: 52
    edited December 1969

    OK, since I am asking, how about another question:

    What I am doing is animating chemical molecules. After spinning and moving places, then I want them to mate. Well, to combine with bonds changing places and new connections being made.

    If I group atoms into molecules, then it seems the changes at a later time in the Sequencer make the grouping and un-grouping go haywire. One solution is not to group but grouping makes spinning possible, whether by Modification or by tedious movement.

    So is it possible to group and re-group in Carrara?


    Thanks

  • PhilWPhilW Posts: 1,716
    edited December 1969

    For spinning on more than one axis at a time, I would use a target helper object. Parent your object to the target helper, apply the first spin to the object itself and the second spin to the target helper. That way they won't interfere with each other and you should get the motion you need. You can of course "nest" this technique if required - I used something similar last year for random atomic vibrations in three dimensions, using three separate movements with the Random tweener.

    Your next issue requires a bit of a trick. You cannot dynamically group and ungroup (or parent and unparent) objects through an animation. The most common application would be picking something up - it needs to be stationery at first as the hand comes in, but once the hand closes on it, you want it parented to the hand.

    So you cheat and have two objects! The first is static, the second is parented to the hand, but the parented one starts with visibility turned off. At the appropriate frame in your animation, switch the visibility of the two objects (which can be keyframed) so that only one is ever visible. It's a little like a magician's sleight of hand trick!

    You can use this for picking things up, dropping or throwing things, etc and I am sure that it could be applied to your molecule example. There is an example of picking up and releasing in my latest animation which uses this trick:
    http://youtu.be/61wxc6X_hRY

    I hope this helps!

  • hrpschrdhrpschrd Posts: 52
    edited December 1969

    Thanks PhilW! I am honored with your help. I just showed another person your Tribal Light animation to applause. Very cool, although my wife wants to know why the women are moving to men's voices . . .
    Ah, well.
    You said atomic vibrations? Can you show us?

    hrpschrd

  • hrpschrdhrpschrd Posts: 52
    edited May 2012

    switch the visibility of the two objects (which can be keyframed) so that only one is ever visible

    It doesn't seem possible to change visibility within the keyframe for primitives. Then I would only need one object, too.

    Post edited by hrpschrd on
  • PhilWPhilW Posts: 1,716
    edited December 1969

    hrpschrd said:
    switch the visibility of the two objects (which can be keyframed) so that only one is ever visible

    It doesn't seem possible to change visibility within the keyframe for primitives. Then I would only need one object, too.

    It is definitely possible to keyframe visibility for primitives. Try this:
    1 - Create a new scene and drop in a sphere (or other primitive) towards the left of the screen.
    2 - Go to the final frame and move the object to the right of the screen.
    3 - Run the animation and you will see it cross the screen from one side to the other.
    4 - Move to a frame around 1/3 through the duration (the exact time is not critical) and click off visibility (in the General panel where it says Visible, Animated, Casts Shadows, Receive Shadow)
    5 - Move to 2/3 through the animation and click Visible again and it should turn it back on.
    6 - When you now run the animation you should see the primitive move, disappear, reappear and complete the motion.

    I am assuming you have Auto Keyframe On - this is the default.

    Let us know!

  • PhilWPhilW Posts: 1,716
    edited December 1969

    ...just to answer your earlier points:
    - the chanting men were clearly there but out of the frame so that you can hear them but not see them. The women are not chanting, their mouths don't move!

    I did a series of atomic and cell animations but it was for a commercial client so I can't simply post these. I'll maybe have a look at doing a little tutorial or demo on this.

  • hrpschrdhrpschrd Posts: 52
    edited December 1969

    Thanks again PhilW. Creating a new object and getting visibility controlled is easy. I don't know why I had so much trouble but it may have been because I was using Duplicate to create objects and they were somehow tied to other objects and I couldn't control them. A mystery.

    I am now working on the target helper hint and will report back.

    Please do a tutorial on atomic animations! Maybe there is an easier way to animate chemistry than Carrara but even my 9 year old can use Carrara (without the manual)!

  • hrpschrdhrpschrd Posts: 52
    edited December 1969

    Tracking Helper help?

    I created a cube.
    I created a helper cube with spin in Z axis.
    I added Track to the first cube and linked it to the helper cube. Enabeled Track and Track Rotation. First cube spins like helper. Good

    Added spin to the first cube and it stuck with its own spin ignoring the helper.

    What am I missing?

  • 3DAGE3DAGE Posts: 2,025
    edited May 2012

    Hi hrpschrd :)

    I'd stick to "Target helper objects" instead of making real objects as helpers.
    Target helper objects can be coloured , and named to help you identify what's going on in the scene.

    Here's a quick example of an Neutron and a couple of Electrons ,.. I've made all the objects geometric, so you can easily see the rotation

    The Neutron is controlled by a target helper object with a spin modifier.
    The Electron is also rotated around the neutron by using a target helper object, positioned at the neutron centre and rotated using a spin modifier,. the electron is Offset from the neutron, and it also has a spin modifier applied to make it spin as it rotates around the neutron.

    I've then Duplicated that electron and target helper, named it to electron2, and moved the starting position of the electron and the axis of the spin modifier.

    http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7907045/Atomspin.car

    Hope it helps :)

    Post edited by 3DAGE on
  • hrpschrdhrpschrd Posts: 52
    edited December 1969

    You and PhilW talk about Target helpers but I can't find those in the manual by searching except for with respect to IK.
    Can you be specific about those or tell me where to find the basics?

    hrpschrd

  • 3DAGE3DAGE Posts: 2,025
    edited December 1969

    Hi Hrpschrd

    it should be on the INSERT menu ...Insert / Target Helper Object
    .
    After you add a Target helper,.. you can select it, then go to the Effects panel, and change it's size and colour.
    you can rename it in the General panel.

    THO.jpg
    588 x 702 - 91K
  • hrpschrdhrpschrd Posts: 52
    edited May 2012

    Sorry, 3DAGE, dumb question. Just didn't see it.

    Wow, is that sweet, the way you can manipulate things with target helpers!

    Thanks everybody!

    Caveat emptor:

    If one is moving an object as well as spinning it (in my case), the Target Helper Object affects both positions. If you move the THO to track the position of the object it is parenting, then, even if you are really careful, the THO changes the position of the object quite a bit.

    I thought this would be a nice way to move and oscillate atoms and molecules but it is too unpredictable.

    Post edited by hrpschrd on
  • 3DAGE3DAGE Posts: 2,025
    edited May 2012

    Hi Hrpschrd
    If you want to animate the movement of a complete Atom (nucleus and it's spinning electrons) then you can select all of those components, and go to Edit / Group, or in the Animation menu / Create Animated group (which would probably be better in this case.
    That will give you the ability to animate the entire group / animated group, as a single item, while the individual parts are still animated within that.
    .
    When you create an "Animated Group", you'll also add the ability to create and use NLA clips and tracks.
    You can then Drag and drop that Atom-Group into your "My Objects" section in the Browser,. that drag that back into your Scene Instance list to create another Atom-group, then you can give it a different name or number.
    .
    You can also add another target helper object to control the movement or rotation of all the Atom-groups you make

    If you want the electrons to Vibrate while they're orbiting the nucleus, you can add a Shake modifier to each of the electrons

    here's a quick updated example scene :

    http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7907045/AtomSpin2.car

    Hope it helps :)

    Post edited by 3DAGE on
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