Carrara v8.5.0.149 (PC/Mac) Beta Update

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Comments

  • MoviehawkMoviehawk Posts: 30
    edited December 1969

    I plan to keep my computer running - with Carrara loaded. Hope that see's me through the weekend. Somebody has dropped the ball! (again!)

  • Bo_de_NarrBo_de_Narr Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    I am realy, realy sick of this serialnumber nonsense
    what is the new serialnumber for this damend beta ?
    (remember me never try again a beta form DAZ3D)

  • TraumadorTraumador Posts: 3
    edited December 1969

    On what planet and universe does a company charge hundreds of dollars for a program they are going to render unless on a monthly to weekly basis.

    I'm not buying anymore Daz products if this keeps up. I've never hit any other software that shuts down due to things the company is doing, removed from my machine. I'm getting royally sick of having my Carrara shut down one weekend a month, and having to search through a forum to find the answer of unlocking it. The least you could do to make up for this horrific costumer service (by which I mean rendering the product I paid you for completely useless) by emailing us notices and new serial numbers!

    Seriously putting out a serial number with an expire date, but not bothering to put up a replacement BEFORE that expiriation date...

  • StezzaStezza Posts: 1,031
    edited December 1969

    where does one download the official latest release version?

    I reset my downloads to get it and all I get is this 8.5 beta version which has expired!

  • JoeMamma2000JoeMamma2000 Posts: 2,416
    edited December 1969

    Not only is DAZ making everyone all upset with this serial number thing, but look, here's the kind of useless nonsense people waste their time on while waiting for a new S/N:


    http://youtu.be/FdEpEsrylO4

    I call it a "Creeping Traumador". Hold on, make that a "Multi modal, quad legged, dual ported Creeping Traumador".


    BTW, has anyone figured how to insert Youtubes?

  • Kendall SearsKendall Sears Posts: 1,882
    edited December 1969

    Traumador said:
    On what planet and universe does a company charge hundreds of dollars for a program they are going to render unless on a monthly to weekly basis.

    I'm not buying anymore Daz products if this keeps up. I've never hit any other software that shuts down due to things the company is doing, removed from my machine. I'm getting royally sick of having my Carrara shut down one weekend a month, and having to search through a forum to find the answer of unlocking it. The least you could do to make up for this horrific costumer service (by which I mean rendering the product I paid you for completely useless) by emailing us notices and new serial numbers!

    Seriously putting out a serial number with an expire date, but not bothering to put up a replacement BEFORE that expiriation date...


    Why did you download and install a time-limited beta if you didn't accept that this could happen? The production version is still fully functional and not time limited.


    Kendall

  • JaguarEllaJaguarElla Posts: 10,376
    edited December 1969

    I can accept that but am annoyed I used the mip map option for textures instead of altering it in preferences as most my saved projects, and I used the bloody beta for most!! need to be totally retextured to use.
    that said, I bought an awful lot of Genesis stuff I am at present converting for iClone instead while I am waiting!!!!
    no facial animation though and
    ugh
    I had to use Hexagon to fix bits!!!
    gotta go to work so hopefully serial up when I get home in about 8 hours time.
    kinda liking, I mean LOVING Genesis but sooooooo not prepared to have to use studio!!
    which I will have to for speech if I decide to do a video.

  • MoviehawkMoviehawk Posts: 30
    edited December 1969


    Why did you download and install a time-limited beta if you didn't accept that this could happen? The production version is still fully functional and not time limited.
    Kendall

    Past practice and common sense.
    For the past (what 6-9 months?) we have been given betas with expiry dates - but always have had extensions or update to the beta.
    It is not unreasonable for anyone to have expected that DAZ would have - again - extended the expiration date or provided a new update.

    If there was to be no extension or update, common courtesy and basic customer service policies would have dictated that an announcement go up that this was going to be the case. No harm no foul - as long as it is communicated to the customer/tester base. Lack of an update or extension - plus the failure to communicate - is just poor management.
    Additional - the production version (8.1) does not support genesis - which is the major change in 8.5 that we have been testing.
    I'm sure sometime tomorrow or Monday, it'll get straightened out - in the meantime - it just pisses people off.


    Allen

  • Kendall SearsKendall Sears Posts: 1,882
    edited December 1969

    I can accept that but am annoyed I used the mip map option for textures instead of altering it in preferences as most my saved projects, and I used the bloody beta for most!! need to be totally retextured to use.
    that said, I bought an awful lot of Genesis stuff I am at present converting for iClone instead while I am waiting!!!!
    no facial animation though and
    ugh
    I had to use Hexagon to fix bits!!!
    gotta go to work so hopefully serial up when I get home in about 8 hours time.
    kinda liking, I mean LOVING Genesis but sooooooo not prepared to have to use studio!!
    which I will have to for speech if I decide to do a video.


    I agree that the S/N going inactive is irritating. That being said, we all knew that this was not only possible, but likely. I looked at the date of expiration immediately after it was posted and saw that it was on a weekend and planned accordingly. I have so many projects going that losing one for a couple of days is not a problem.


    It could be worse...


    Kendall

  • Kendall SearsKendall Sears Posts: 1,882
    edited December 1969

    Moviehawk said:

    Why did you download and install a time-limited beta if you didn't accept that this could happen? The production version is still fully functional and not time limited.
    Kendall

    Past practice and common sense.
    For the past (what 6-9 months?) we have been given betas with expiry dates - but always have had extensions or update to the beta.
    It is not unreasonable for anyone to have expected that DAZ would have - again - extended the expiration date or provided a new update.

    If there was to be no extension or update, common courtesy and basic customer service policies would have dictated that an announcement go up that this was going to be the case. No harm no foul - as long as it is communicated to the customer/tester base. Lack of an update or extension - plus the failure to communicate - is just poor management.
    Additional - the production version (8.1) does not support genesis - which is the major change in 8.5 that we have been testing.
    I'm sure sometime tomorrow or Monday, it'll get straightened out - in the meantime - it just pisses people off.


    Allen

    I can think of at least 2 times recently where the S/N expired and we've had to wait for a new one to be issued. Since this is a weekend, there is no one at work to issue a new S/N.


    It's that last statement that I don't get, what give us a right to be "pissed" at all? Beta testing is a privilege, not a right. Hell, with beta testing you're not even guaranteed that a particular version EVEN WORKS AT ALL. Sure, DAZ's beta's tend to be more toward gamma, but that doesn't mitigate the fact that one should not become reliant on a feature of a beta, period.


    There's nothing saying that DAZ couldn't just end the beta right now and we all have to wait six months for the general release. It is their right. It's not likely to happen, but it can. Microsoft has done it, still does it with their "Release Previews". How many here are going to scream "Microsoft has caused me to have to go back to Windows 7! I'm never using another Microsoft product again!" Hmmm? Yet, the same is said in reference to DAZ.


    Kendall.

  • JoeMamma2000JoeMamma2000 Posts: 2,416
    edited December 1969

    Okay, in order to give a sense of the immense size of the "multi modal, quad legged, dual ported, Creeping Traumador", I have re-rendered a movie of it travelling thru a local Wal Mart parking lot and encountering a standard dumpster. Needless to say, the dumpster did not have a good day. In fact it got squished so hard it stuck to the underside of outboard Traumador leg #2.


    http://youtu.be/GbBGct-Ac2U


    Be careful. Those Creeping Traumadors can cause, like, lots of trauma. I mean it.

  • JoeMamma2000JoeMamma2000 Posts: 2,416
    edited December 1969

    Beta testing is a privilege, not a right..


    Abso-damn-lutely. I agree 100%. Beta testing, or any other testing of a developer's work, is clearly a privilege.


    Sure, they make mistakes just like anyone else. They're only human. But you, the customer, should consider yourself privileged to be able to find his mistakes. And it should be an honor to do all the additional work they need to be able to help pinpoint the source of their mistakes.


    Heck, that happens in every industry. Customers are always given the privilege, the opportunity to find a manufacturer's bugs. For example, in the...well...umm....in any case, it's a privilege.


    Just like you should consider it a privilege to help developers with other things they need to accomplish. Heck, when's the last time you asked a developer for the privilege of doing his laundry? Or walk his dog. These guys work hard, and put in a lot of hours. How do you expect them to do all that work if they have to take time to feed the dog, huh?


    I suggest we start a "take a developer to lunch" day. I can only hope that they'll allow us that opportunity.

  • Kendall SearsKendall Sears Posts: 1,882
    edited July 2012

    Beta testing is a privilege, not a right..


    Abso-damn-lutely. I agree 100%. Beta testing, or any other testing of a developer's work, is clearly a privilege.


    Sure, they make mistakes just like anyone else. They're only human. But you, the customer, should consider yourself privileged to be able to find his mistakes. And it should be an honor to do all the additional work they need to be able to help pinpoint the source of their mistakes.


    Heck, that happens in every industry. Customers are always given the privilege, the opportunity to find a manufacturer's bugs. For example, in the...well...umm....in any case, it's a privilege.


    Just like you should consider it a privilege to help developers with other things they need to accomplish. Heck, when's the last time you asked a developer for the privilege of doing his laundry? Or walk his dog. These guys work hard, and put in a lot of hours. How do you expect them to do all that work if they have to take time to feed the dog, huh?


    I suggest we start a "take a developer to lunch" day. I can only hope that they'll allow us that opportunity.


    The last time I checked, one had to volunteer to be a beta tester. In most cases one must apply, sign, and sometimes (horrors!) pay to get to beta test. DAZ allowed any Carrara user to volunteer, no one forced you to download, install, and run the beta. In exchange for getting access to the "new stuff" early, one is expected to find, and report, issues. If you don't want to take part then sit down, wait until it gets released into production and do without.


    Don't like it, don't do it.
    Kendall

    Post edited by Kendall Sears on
  • JoeMamma2000JoeMamma2000 Posts: 2,416
    edited December 1969

    Don't like it, don't do it.


    Yes. I know. I've heard all the arguments over and over, many times. But nothing in your response addresses your position that it is a "privilege". Because it's not. It is a service performed for the vendor by the customer. It is a voluntary service, but it is a service, nonetheless.


    "Don't like it, don't do it" is a sidestep of the issue. That only addresses the voluntary nature of the service. No question, it's voluntary. But it is work, that requires significant time and resources by the customer (their own computer, cost of electricity, software and other computer skills, etc.). Work that the vendor would otherwise have to pay someone to perform, and resources the vendor would otherwise have to pay for. And it is also skilled work, not minimum wage level work. Nowhere else on the planet can the vendor get people to work like that for free. And in few, if any, other industries is this a practice. Therefore, it is also an exceptional service, and one that the vendor should be incredibly grateful for.


    The customers' motives for doing this service, and the fact that there are those who do the service, is absolutely irrelevant to the discussion, and does not somehow suddenly convert a service into a privilege.


    Any vendor who has a different attitude needs to have their heads examined. It is absolutely shocking to me that there are software developers out there who honestly think it is a privilege for customers to be able to do this. All they need is for some day the customer base to wise up and decide they aren't gonna provide this service any more, and see what happens.

  • Kendall SearsKendall Sears Posts: 1,882
    edited July 2012

    Don't like it, don't do it.


    Yes. I know. I've heard all the arguments over and over, many times. But nothing in your response addresses your position that it is a "privilege". Because it's not. It is a service performed for the vendor by the customer. It is a voluntary service, but it is a service, nonetheless.

    How about the English definition of the word privilege? From freedictionary:

    a. A special advantage, immunity, permission, right, or benefit granted to or enjoyed by an individual, class, or caste.

    b. Such an advantage, immunity, or right held as a prerogative of status or rank, and exercised to the exclusion or detriment of others.


    DS users aren;t eligible, nor are Poser users, only Carrara users. Definition of class.
    Access to software others don't have. Definition of Special Advantage.


    Pretty much defines privilege does it not?


    One need not download, install, or use the software, denoting that one has a desire to use software that few others have. One does not have to report errors, or even that they've even tried the software, but tradition implies that one should report one's results. But that is tradition, not requirement. Therefore it is NOT a service, as nothing is REQUIRED of the recipient. If anything, it (bug reporting) is a 'thank you' gift from the recipient to the developers.


    Kendall

    Post edited by Kendall Sears on
  • JoeMamma2000JoeMamma2000 Posts: 2,416
    edited December 1969

    Pretty much defines privilege does it not?

    Kendall, baby, step back a bit and stop digging your heels in, 'K?

    You're saying that just because DAZ only allows certain people to help them, then suddenly that makes it a privilege? Come on, you can't really believe that....


    Here's an example...


    Neighbor comes up to you, says, "Hey, Kendall, let me mow your lawn for you. No charge, I just want to do you a favor".


    Kendall says "Um, well, thanks, but I only allow people who are wearing blue shirts to mow my lawn. Thanks, but no thanks".


    Now, you tell me. Was the neighbor who offered to mow your lawn (for free, using his own time and equipment) getting the privilege to mow your lawn, or doing you a voluntary service?


    Just because they restrict who they ask (or allow) to perform the service, has absolutely no relevance whatsoever to the nature of the act.


    Now you can argue all day and until tomorrow about the technical definition if that's important to you, but the sense and the nature of the act is one of voluntary service. If you don't believe that, then all I can say is I'm just baffled. Doesn't mean I'm right, I'm just baffled that someone would think that.

  • cosmos1138cosmos1138 Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    beta tester or not it is a reciprocal arrangement - we help them and they help us - to this end, how hard/long would it take a monkey to push a level to generate a new serial number? They are an unprofessional organization in their duty of full discloser. Take the Daz Studio Advanced - no where is it stated the lip-sync is not included due to a copyright fee issue - you buy it thinking you can speed up your talking heads and well - no way. If they post a serial with a date then they need to ensure that it is updated for those member who have taken the leap. 8.1 does not run on Lion so unlike Windows users we have NO CHOICE but to be beta testers if we want to use the $400 program we paid for. Full Disclosure: I was a professor of HRD for 6 years so I look at this from a business model point of view - it sucks.

  • holly wetcircuitholly wetcircuit Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    All this "beta privilege" seems to forget there are SERIOUS BUGS in C8.1, including the memory leak that makes animation impossible.


    If DAZ would just release a bug fix, rather than holding us all hostage to genesis, this would be a non-issue. I would have even paid for it, but this is ridiculous.

  • JoeMamma2000JoeMamma2000 Posts: 2,416
    edited December 1969

    I agree about this serial number nonsense. I mean, come on guys, that's just bush league. Seems like it's always "oops, I forgot to get a new serial number for you guys..."


    Geesh, set up a reminder on your computer or your cellphone or whatever. It just shows a lack of respect for customers. You've got a group of people who have been, for what, 9 or 10 months, helping you guys find bugs in your software, and you know they're setting up stuff and using it, and you know they're gonna have work going on with it. So geesh, at least have a little bit of respect.


    I hope it's not more of that "it's a privilege" nonsense showing its head.

  • EffelbertEffelbert Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Thanks Daz, now I have a beta that wont work, I know you are all so busy trying to fix the clusterf**k that is the site and all, but thats no excuse, guess i will have to drop back to 8.1 till you sort out a little code for us ;)

  • thoromyrthoromyr Posts: 391
    edited December 1969

    argh! I was trying to get a render node going to speed things up (renders are taking ~4 days on my antiquated hardware) and wasn't able to get it started. Now the serial won't work because its the 15th. Now its the weekend so it'll probably be at least a day before a new serial number is posted. Good thing I don't mind rolling back the clock (though the render node seems to be more "timely" about complaining than the regular carrara).


    Pretty please can we have another serial number? Or a full release?

  • MoviehawkMoviehawk Posts: 30
    edited December 1969

    All this "beta privilege" seems to forget there are SERIOUS BUGS in C8.1, including the memory leak that makes animation impossible.


    If DAZ would just release a bug fix, rather than holding us all hostage to genesis, this would be a non-issue. I would have even paid for it, but this is ridiculous.

    Agreed! And I agree with some of what Kendall is saying. But this is just a lack of consideration. If they want to end the beta testing - fine, their right to do so. If they want to delay the next update or not extend the current version with an updated serial - that's fine too. But they need to tell people that.
    It would take about 1 minute for some admin to log in and post a message just telling us what's going on. Is a new serial coming out? A new update, or new production release? Or is the whole thing delayed for Xnumber of days. weeks.

    Allen

  • djmulcahydjmulcahy Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Ugh.
    Again?
    The big problem here is that 8.5 has been publicly beta-tested now for nearly a year. Most of us have incorporated many of our projects into the rolling betas, using Genesis content which we've purchased for just that purpose, with the intent of being able to just use all of that in the official 8.5 release.
    When these serial numbers expire... poof! Projects are on hold.
    We can't just pull everything back to C8 and keep going.
    Even though it hasn't been officially released, many of us have made an investment, in both time and money, in 8.5.

  • Nigel RobinsonNigel Robinson Posts: 8
    edited December 1969

    It's all about perspective, though, isn't it?

    I've Beta tested for Adobe. You know from day one that they'll cut you off without a lifeline the moment the expiry date arrives and then not release the finished thing for months (which then costs a fortune and Beta testers don't get a discount for helping out).

    You know what your getting into from day one.

    DAZ, however, usually keep issuing Beta upgrades and serials until the release date so you can just drift seamlessly into using the latest release version. AND, if you're a Platinum Club member you get a discount AND the upgrade price is usually pretty damned reasonable.

    This time there's been an interruption to the process, which I'm sure they're working to sort out, but we are using Beta software, so if you're inconvenienced you should really have had a backup plan to allow for this. I was using it for a piece of paid work and, luckily, managed to switch to 8.1 without too much hassle - but I appreciate I shouldn't have been using Beta software with an expiry date for critical work.

    Attacking the DAZ guys is inappropriate here. They don't owe us anything. The software always had an expiry date. It's just not the pattern we were expecting.

    One company I buy from sells their final release software when it's way buggier than any Carrara Beta, then charges you for the "upgrade" when all it does is fix the bugs in it from the last release. Now they've started selling their software in "Suites" so a $19.99 extension will cost £190.99 to upgrade as it comes in a suite with stuff you don't need!

    As I say. Perspective.

  • mcashmanmcashman Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    In the middle of a project this weekend and serial number expired. C'mon DAZ,team, need the new one today, not next week!

  • mcashmanmcashman Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Looks like I'm able to work in trial mode. Thank goodness. Hopefully the Daz team will have a serial number for me next week, but at least I can finish this project and provide feedback on any bugs I find.

  • holly wetcircuitholly wetcircuit Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    The forums... the store... now this.


    We could have had a C8.2 months and months ago.


    _

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  • VFX13VFX13 Posts: 5
    edited December 1969

    Any update on this I'm unable to use the product I paid for.

  • donatodonato Posts: 17
    edited December 1969

    I'm really bummed.

  • wcwilcoxwcwilcox Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Do you think anyone at Daz is reading these posts

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