Subsurface Shaders... WOW!

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  • WilmapWilmap Posts: 2,128
    edited December 1969

    My first render using the SSS Shaders. Used Skin B.

    I'm quite pleased with the result, but what do others think? anything I can do to change things?

    Image_3.png
    600 x 776 - 476K
  • GeddGedd Posts: 2,444
    edited December 1969

    I like it, with the caveat of the nostrils... would either tweak the settings or stuff a negative green lamp up there ;p

  • Andrey PestryakovAndrey Pestryakov Posts: 100
    edited December 1969

    Phlox said:
    Nice sedor - the bleeding creates some nice effects. :)

    I threw lots of things into the melting pot here. Love the shaders.

    Super render! How could you make such materials?

  • marblemarble Posts: 1,017
    edited December 1969

    First attempt with the Toon shaders...

    Hitomi_SSS_002.png
    1600 x 1600 - 3M
  • dan.shivedan.shive Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    First off, EEP! Someone grab Hitomi a towel!

    Secondly, I don't suppose anyone figured out why SSS can turn some things black? I saw it mentioned earlier but this is a long thread and I'm having trouble finding if it was.

    I was doing some experiments of my own, and, well, that Skinny Top cropped shirt is supposed to be white. I doubled the diffuse and it still turns out this way, and that's even with trying to use the toolkit that was released today. I was hoping that would make things dummy-proof enough for a dang fool like me, but I guess not ^^;

    test.png
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  • marblemarble Posts: 1,017
    edited December 1969

    dan.shive said:
    First off, EEP! Someone grab Hitomi a towel!

    Oh, now the censors will be out and so will my pic. Ahh well.

  • dan.shivedan.shive Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    marble said:
    dan.shive said:
    First off, EEP! Someone grab Hitomi a towel!

    Oh, now the censors will be out and so will my pic. Ahh well.


    Wait, what? I don't think there's actually anything not allowed in that pic.

  • Herald of FireHerald of Fire Posts: 3,363
    edited December 1969

    dan.shive said:
    First off, EEP! Someone grab Hitomi a towel!

    Secondly, I don't suppose anyone figured out why SSS can turn some things black? I saw it mentioned earlier but this is a long thread and I'm having trouble finding if it was.

    I was doing some experiments of my own, and, well, that Skinny Top cropped shirt is supposed to be white. I doubled the diffuse and it still turns out this way, and that's even with trying to use the toolkit that was released today. I was hoping that would make things dummy-proof enough for a dang fool like me, but I guess not ^^;


    Make sure the scale is set appropriately for the figure. That's the biggest contributor to the 'black SSS' issue. An issue which I have encountered more than a few times I might add.

  • marblemarble Posts: 1,017
    edited December 1969

    I'm never sure ... how much buttock is allowed?

    :roll:

  • scorpioscorpio Posts: 3,776
    edited December 1969

    What is and isn't allowed remains a mystery to me, I've asked for clarification on the subject and never received a reply.

  • GeddGedd Posts: 2,444
    edited December 1969

    I think because it's hard to put a specific on something like that. A lot is based on a combination of the amount and the overall tone. It's hard not to be subjective without being a bit overly strict I find.

  • ChoholeChohole Posts: 19,363
    edited December 1969

    marble said:
    I'm never sure ... how much buttock is allowed?

    :roll:

    Richard did explain it here. http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/3279_97/ Posted as an announcement at the top of every forum.

  • marblemarble Posts: 1,017
    edited December 1969

    Well, anyway, I think she looks good in her new SSSkin (even if I say so myself) :coolsmile:

  • marblemarble Posts: 1,017
    edited May 2013

    chohole said:
    marble said:
    I'm never sure ... how much buttock is allowed?

    :roll:

    Richard did explain it here. http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/3279_97/ Posted as an announcement at the top of every forum.

    Yes, I read that. That's why I mentioned buttock specifically.

    "or major part of the buttocks"

    Post edited by marble on
  • dan.shivedan.shive Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Make sure the scale is set appropriately for the figure. That's the biggest contributor to the 'black SSS' issue. An issue which I have encountered more than a few times I might add.

    I don't think that's the issue. I don't know what I'm doing with Shader Scale, BUT I have the gummy shaders and I tried all three of the available scale variations from teddy bear to elephant (0.5 - 15). The shirt got VERY slightly brighter, but still no better than a really dark grey.

    I've tried making everything with a color white and still got nothing. I'm completely baffled.

  • Herald of FireHerald of Fire Posts: 3,363
    edited December 1969

    dan.shive said:
    Make sure the scale is set appropriately for the figure. That's the biggest contributor to the 'black SSS' issue. An issue which I have encountered more than a few times I might add.

    I don't think that's the issue. I don't know what I'm doing with Shader Scale, BUT I have the gummy shaders and I tried all three of the available scale variations from teddy bear to elephant (0.5 - 15). The shirt got VERY slightly brighter, but still no better than a really dark grey.

    I've tried making everything with a color white and still got nothing. I'm completely baffled.


    Again, I had the same issue. Sometimes you need to lower the scale below or above that of the presets. For example, a recent render I posted in this very thread had a lot of black areas. I ended up reducing the scale down to 0.1 and it rendered fine. The 'small scale' preset lowers it to 0.5.

  • dan.shivedan.shive Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    marble said:
    chohole said:
    marble said:
    I'm never sure ... how much buttock is allowed?

    :roll:

    Richard did explain it here. http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/3279_97/ Posted as an announcement at the top of every forum.

    Yes, I read that. That's why I mentioned buttock specifically.

    "or major part of the buttocks"


    It seems like a side view that reveals no more than would be shown if wearing a string bikini should be fine. They have "worse" in the shop.

  • HellboyHellboy Posts: 683
    edited December 1969

    marble said:
    I'm never sure ... how much buttock is allowed?

    :roll:

    About this much:
    http://www.costumesofnashua.com/CNWebSite105/Active905/Pictures/PicPilgrim/piligrim18070.jpg

    When in doubt, use it as an appropiate dress code guide.
    :)

  • marblemarble Posts: 1,017
    edited December 1969

    OK ... NOW it is clear. Thank you so much ;-)

  • scorpioscorpio Posts: 3,776
    edited December 1969

    dan.shive said:
    First off, EEP! Someone grab Hitomi a towel!

    Secondly, I don't suppose anyone figured out why SSS can turn some things black? I saw it mentioned earlier but this is a long thread and I'm having trouble finding if it was.

    I was doing some experiments of my own, and, well, that Skinny Top cropped shirt is supposed to be white. I doubled the diffuse and it still turns out this way, and that's even with trying to use the toolkit that was released today. I was hoping that would make things dummy-proof enough for a dang fool like me, but I guess not ^^;

    Its to do with the ID items need different ID's.

  • dan.shivedan.shive Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Again, I had the same issue. Sometimes you need to lower the scale below or above that of the presets. For example, a recent render I posted in this very thread had a lot of black areas. I ended up reducing the scale down to 0.1 and it rendered fine. The 'small scale' preset lowers it to 0.5.

    I should have mentioned-- Prior to your suggestion, I was trying with scale at the default, which is 0.1 After reading your more recent post, I tried at 0.01 and even 0. There are minor variations in the results, but they're all dark grey.

  • dan.shivedan.shive Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Its to do with the ID items need different ID's.

    Do you mean the group id's under surfaces? I had them set to 2. Genesis's surfaces are set to 1.

  • scorpioscorpio Posts: 3,776
    edited May 2013

    While my goal was to make the shader user friendly I also wanted it to have a lot of flexibility. Subsurface scattering is fairly complex but my hope is that the shader can allow for a great variety of different looks yet not be too overwhelming.

    Here are some images showing the effects that various scale and group ID settings have.

    Remember it is important to use the same SSS shading rate and scale settings across all surfaces that share the same group ID.

    This is some info from several pages back it might help.
    Page 12 sorry the quote didn't include the image, I forgot it doesn't.
    Post #178

    Post edited by scorpio on
  • MKeyesMKeyes Posts: 346
    edited December 1969

    I am soooo excited about this, and I would be even more excited if I knew the proper procedure of applying it. I did read the brief quick start manual, buuuut - I still don't get it. So uh, if someone who gets it, could help me please with the right steps in making this wonderful thing happen? Please?

    1.) Load model
    2.) Add texture (skin)
    3.) Choose areas of body
    4.) Add whichever subsurface shader base you like

    Is that right? Yes? No? If no, how? And what light preset works best with it? Please? I really want to give this a go and then, get it, to use it.

    Thanks... :)

  • dan.shivedan.shive Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Thanks for the assistance, but as far as I can tell, there's some issue with the skinny top model. I can apply SSS to other things just fine, but that doesn't seem to want to cooperate.

  • Herald of FireHerald of Fire Posts: 3,363
    edited December 1969

    More experimentation. This time I lowered the subsurface scatter effect to make it more subtle and bring out the detail in her face. The original settings pretty much annihilated any imperfections and blemishes and gave a more toonish look to her. I think my tweaks came out rather nicely, but what are your thoughts?

    No postwork was used in this image.

    Satsuki_Closeup.png
    1000 x 1000 - 1M
  • MABMAB Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Mercedesk said:
    I am soooo excited about this, and I would be even more excited if I knew the proper procedure of applying it. I did read the brief quick start manual, buuuut - I still don't get it. So uh, if someone who gets it, could help me please with the right steps in making this wonderful thing happen? Please?

    1.) Load model
    2.) Add texture (skin)
    3.) Choose areas of body
    4.) Add whichever subsurface shader base you like

    Is that right? Yes? No? If no, how? And what light preset works best with it? Please? I really want to give this a go and then, get it, to use it.

    Thanks... :)


    1.) Load model --Yes
    2.) Add texture (skin) --If you want a detailed skin on there
    3.) Choose areas of body --Yes and make sure you have the figure also selected and then select the surfaces you want the shader applied to in the surfaces palette.
    4.) Add whichever subsurface shader base you like --Yes, but if you want to use a skin texture, be sure to hold down control while applying the shader and then opt to not replace the maps in the window that comes up. I'm rendering right now, so can't check on exact wording in the window, but it's pretty easy to figure out. You want the one that starts with "Ignore" if you wish to keep the applied maps while adding the shader.

    Then, if your skin has bump or displacement, you'll want to tweak the settings on those in the surfaces palette, and you might need to tweak the specularity, as the preset you use might not be specialized for the specularity maps that may be included with the skin you chose to add the SSS shader to.

  • MKeyesMKeyes Posts: 346
    edited December 1969

    MAB said:
    Mercedesk said:
    I am soooo excited about this, and I would be even more excited if I knew the proper procedure of applying it. I did read the brief quick start manual, buuuut - I still don't get it. So uh, if someone who gets it, could help me please with the right steps in making this wonderful thing happen? Please?

    1.) Load model
    2.) Add texture (skin)
    3.) Choose areas of body
    4.) Add whichever subsurface shader base you like

    Is that right? Yes? No? If no, how? And what light preset works best with it? Please? I really want to give this a go and then, get it, to use it.

    Thanks... :)


    1.) Load model --Yes
    2.) Add texture (skin) --If you want a detailed skin on there
    3.) Choose areas of body --Yes and make sure you have the figure also selected and then select the surfaces you want the shader applied to in the surfaces palette.
    4.) Add whichever subsurface shader base you like --Yes, but if you want to use a skin texture, be sure to hold down control while applying the shader and then opt to not replace the maps in the window that comes up. I'm rendering right now, so can't check on exact wording in the window, but it's pretty easy to figure out. You want the one that starts with "Ignore" if you wish to keep the applied maps while adding the shader.

    Then, if your skin has bump or displacement, you'll want to tweak the settings on those in the surfaces palette, and you might need to tweak the specularity, as the preset you use might not be specialized for the specularity maps that may be included with the skin you chose to add the SSS shader to.

    1.) Making faces... (scared)
    2.) Chewing lip
    3.) scratching head
    4.) Scared - confused - worried
    5.) Will try it again... and will hold down ctrl - This is PC instruction right? Because I have model selected, body surfaces selected and then everything turned VIVID BOLD PINK - or solid WHITE. Rendered weird.

    Okay... will give this another go... thanks... I get a feeling, I'll be back... heehee - sorree %-P

  • scorpioscorpio Posts: 3,776
    edited December 1969

    dan.shive said:
    Thanks for the assistance, but as far as I can tell, there's some issue with the skinny top model. I can apply SSS to other things just fine, but that doesn't seem to want to cooperate.

    Ugg I hate it when it turns out to be something to do with the model - which top is it, if I have it I'll give it a try.

  • MKeyesMKeyes Posts: 346
    edited December 1969

    WOW! Something happened! The box popped up, and I chose ignore... uuuhhhh, didn't choose a light set, nor any of those color balls, if I was supposed to, which ones?

    Partials?
    Presets?

    Progress is being made... this is good... I think... better than it was... that's for certain! :)

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