Garibaldi vs. Look At My Hair - which is better overall/better for an amateur?

124

Comments

  • Kendall SearsKendall Sears Posts: 1,885
    edited December 1969

    Mr Bowen said:
    Well, you convinced me to go with your product, Alessandro and Kendall. I picked it up over the weekend. I appreciate that you are continuing to expand the program. Thank you.

    We're very much "into" the expansion. The problem is that our target keeps changing on us! :-)

    We are almost there now. Our testers will be playing with the newest version, and we hope to have a public release very quickly.

    Kendall

  • araneldonaraneldon Posts: 620
    edited May 2013

    In Carrara it is possible to choose which point the comb brush affects on hairs. Do these plugins have this functionality? The public beta of Garibaldi didn't have it.

    Post edited by araneldon on
  • Kendall SearsKendall Sears Posts: 1,885
    edited May 2013

    araneldon said:
    In Carrara it is possible to choose which point the comb brush affects on hairs. Do these plugins have this functionality? The public beta of Garibaldi didn't have it.

    LAMH does this visually. If you start combing at the end, the end is affected. We are adding more tools to make control node selection easier, but that will not be in the 1.06 release. We're already late due to forces beyond our control.

    Kendall

    Post edited by Kendall Sears on
  • GoneGone Posts: 633
    edited December 1969

    araneldon said:
    In Carrara it is possible to choose which point the comb brush affects on hairs. Do these plugins have this functionality? The public beta of Garibaldi didn't have it.

    If you are refering to the ability to select points in the middle of the hair strand for independent movement, then Garibaldi has had that function since the first beta release. Oddly enough, it is called "select points tool".

  • araneldonaraneldon Posts: 620
    edited December 1969

    Gone said:
    If you are refering to the ability to select points in the middle of the hair strand for independent movement, then Garibaldi has had that function since the first beta release. Oddly enough, it is called "select points tool".

    No, I refer to the way the comb affects hair. Right now it pulls every point along which is often not ideal.

    Here is a Carrara tutorial video to demonstrate the idea. The white dots in the preview represent the selected hair point which is to be affected by the brush. Pay attention to the "Point" control and what happens to the guide hairs in the preview.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=N8Mvc7wnWjM#t=123s

  • TrishaTrisha Posts: 50
    edited December 1969

    Hi,

    I bought LAMH plugin but I can't figure out where to go to use it? Something shows up in the tabs list of plugins but I can't see how to start it. The manual says to enter serial codes etc but I can't find how to even get that initial screen up. I'm a real noob, it seems. Can anyone help me out please?

    Thanks in advance :)

  • Alessandro_AMAlessandro_AM Posts: 1,553
    edited December 1969

    Hi,

    I bought LAMH plugin but I can't figure out where to go to use it? Something shows up in the tabs list of plugins but I can't see how to start it. The manual says to enter serial codes etc but I can't find how to even get that initial screen up. I'm a real noob, it seems. Can anyone help me out please?

    Thanks in advance :)

    Hello, please check under the Create menu, there you should have a 'New Look at my Hair object'.

    Also, if it didn't show up in readme installer, be sure to grab the PDF manual here: http://www.furrythings.com/LAMHPlayer/LAMH_Player_manual.pdf

    If you have further question please let me know...

  • Alessandro_AMAlessandro_AM Posts: 1,553
    edited December 1969

    Mr Bowen said:
    Well, you convinced me to go with your product, Alessandro and Kendall. I picked it up over the weekend. I appreciate that you are continuing to expand the program. Thank you.

    We indeed are and we are very excited to bring the next release. :)

  • GoneGone Posts: 633
    edited December 1969

    araneldon said:
    Gone said:
    If you are refering to the ability to select points in the middle of the hair strand for independent movement, then Garibaldi has had that function since the first beta release. Oddly enough, it is called "select points tool".

    No, I refer to the way the comb affects hair. Right now it pulls every point along which is often not ideal.

    Here is a Carrara tutorial video to demonstrate the idea. The white dots in the preview represent the selected hair point which is to be affected by the brush. Pay attention to the "Point" control and what happens to the guide hairs in the preview.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=N8Mvc7wnWjM#t=123s

    While it's not as simple to use, the select points tool does provide a similar functionality - but all the action is done within the tool and not with the comb.

    There's no slider like Carrara has so you can't select all the hairs at once (at least not without a lot of grief) but, once selected, you can move mid points much the same as in Carrara.

    The tool is intended for fine tuning specific areas rather than control of all the hairs the way Carrara does it.

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 16,118
    edited December 1969

    ...I really was hoping this would have been more of a discussion between the differences of how these two tools compare in the way they work to achieve the desired results along with both screen shot and render comparisons. However it predominantly appears to have turned into a second LMAH discussion/troubleshooting thread.

    ...unsubscribing.

  • DisparateDreamerDisparateDreamer Posts: 1,727
    edited December 1969

    Well hopefully the OP saw the things they wanted to know about. And since LAMH tends to be my fav topic i'm more than happy to post details and tips for using it. :)

  • KeryaKerya Posts: 7,241
    edited December 1969

    Kyoto Kid said:
    ...I really was hoping this would have been more of a discussion between the differences of how these two tools compare in the way they work to achieve the desired results along with both screen shot and render comparisons. However it predominantly appears to have turned into a second LMAH discussion/troubleshooting thread.

    ...unsubscribing.

    Let's put it like that: not many will have both ... makes it hard to compare.
    I have Garibaldi (and like it) - Alia has Lamh (and likes it).

    On thing that speaks for Lamh: the creators are active in the forums - contrary to Futurebiscuit, who is missing.
    Against Lamh: there is an extra activation on Alessandros server, the serial number you get from Daz is not enough. (Which is why I will never get Lamh).

  • GoneGone Posts: 633
    edited December 1969

    Normally, I try to avoid getting into these types of discussion because they require reasoned thinking and clear writing.

    I'm retired dammit!!! I don't want to spend my time creating a reasoned document and I certainly don't want to spend time debating it!

    However, I'm one of those people who owns both Garibaldi and LAMH and prefers Garibaldi. I also seem to be the only one who is prepared to speak for Garibaldi.

    Be aware that the LAMH team has indicated that some (possibly all) of the reasons for my preference are going to be addressed in the update. If that happens, I may be persuaded to shift my preference. Until then, this is why I prefer Garibaldi...

    - Marschner hair shader. This is what the big boys use - and its what Garibaldi uses.
    - Garibaldi hair saves with the scene. In fact, once the hair is created, it can only be saved through the DS save menu. It can be saved as a supported asset, wearable preset, scene subset, etc. You can make metadata and have it appear in the smart content pane or just load it from the content library like any other hair prop.
    - the plugin does not need to be open in order to render. As long as the plugin is valid you're good to go. As mentioned above, once the hair is created, it is just another scene object and doesn't require special handling to load, save or render.
    - the hair has render percentage values. At 100%, the hair will render the amount specified when you created (or modified) it. In the parameters pane you can specify a lower render amount to get fewer/thicker hairs or a higher amount to get more/thinner hairs rendered without having to open the plugin to change the amount. The percentages can be changed on a per node basis.
    - the plugin doesn't change the mesh resolution. If you take a high resolution figure into Garibaldi, it remains a high resolution figure when you come back to DS.
    - the only time I ever crashed Garibaldi/DS was during the beta run up to the version 1 release. Since then, I have not crashed - even when I make astoundingly stupid mistakes in Garibaldi. YMMV.
    - Garibaldi feels like a DS plugin. LAMH feels like a bridge to an external app.

    It should be noted that the Garibaldi author has said - several times - that his only interest is to make a ri-curves hair system for DS. Period. That could always change - but that’s the way I understand the situation at this time.

    The LAMH team have made it clear that they intend to push the technology as far as they can. Even version 1 has the ability to replace rendered hair with instanced objects. That, alone, makes the 2 products very different beasts.

    Some of the LAMH tools have a bit more functionality and some just work differently. Whether you like the differences is a matter of personal taste.

    Examples:
    LAMH has the spherize tool. You can use the tool on one or more axes to control the shape. Garibaldi has a similar tool called curl but it only functions on the “Y” axis.

    On the other hand, the Garibaldi comb tool can be stroked down the hair with one click and will influence every hair it touches. It acts like a real comb. In LAMH, the comb has to be touching hair when you click and will only influence the hair that was under the tool at the time of the click.

    Both plugins will let you stack as many hair nodes (shave groups) as your system can handle in one hair style. Both will only let you work with one node at a time. LAMH will let you see all the nodes at once so you can see the relationship between all the nodes and how the changes on the node you are working on are affecting the overall style. Garibaldi will only let you see the node you are working on. You cannot see the overall relationship until you return to DS.

    Both plugins are capable of .obj export. However, in Garibaldi this is an unsupported feature. The LAMH team is happy to support the feature.

    The LAMH team - and users - are very active in the forums and there is a large and growing library of user made presets. Garibaldi - not so much. There were plans to create a user library similar to the LAMH one - but that hasn’t materialised yet.

    Like all apps, each plugin has its pros and cons. Which one is right for you depends on your needs, preferences, and workflow.

    So, that’s my comparison in broad strokes and my reasons for preferring Garibaldi.

    Have at it.

  • Kendall SearsKendall Sears Posts: 1,885
    edited May 2013

    Gone said:
    Normally, I try to avoid getting into these types of discussion because they require reasoned thinking and clear writing.

    I'm retired dammit!!! I don't want to spend my time creating a reasoned document and I certainly don't want to spend time debating it!

    However, I'm one of those people who owns both Garibaldi and LAMH and prefers Garibaldi. I also seem to be the only one who is prepared to speak for Garibaldi.

    Be aware that the LAMH team has indicated that some (possibly all) of the reasons for my preference are going to be addressed in the update. If that happens, I may be persuaded to shift my preference. Until then, this is why I prefer Garibaldi...

    - Marschner hair shader. This is what the big boys use - and its what Garibaldi uses.


    Marschner Shader is already in the LAMH Player. We call it the Human Hair Shader.


    - Garibaldi hair saves with the scene. In fact, once the hair is created, it can only be saved through the DS save menu. It can be saved as a supported asset, wearable preset, scene subset, etc. You can make metadata and have it appear in the smart content pane or just load it from the content library like any other hair prop.

    Again, already available in the player. And part of the new update. EDIT: The .lmh files are still supported because LAMH intends to be ported to many systems in the near future, and we want folks to be able to take the presets with them.


    - the plugin does not need to be open in order to render. As long as the plugin is valid you're good to go. As mentioned above, once the hair is created, it is just another scene object and doesn't require special handling to load, save or render.

    Available in the FREE Player. LAMH no longer needs to be open to render

    I'm not going to get into an advertising war. The majority of your points are already available in the *FREE* player. And as soon as we can, will also be in the full version.

    LAMH is intended to be significantly more than just hair/fur.

    Kendall

    Post edited by Kendall Sears on
  • KeryaKerya Posts: 7,241
    edited December 1969

    Gone said:
    Normally, I try to avoid getting into these types of discussion because they require reasoned thinking and clear writing.

    I'm retired dammit!!! I don't want to spend my time creating a reasoned document and I certainly don't want to spend time debating it!
    ...

    Thank you very much!

  • KeryaKerya Posts: 7,241
    edited December 1969

    ...
    I'm not going to get into an advertising war. The majority of your points are already available in the *FREE* player. And as soon as we can, will also be in the full version...

    As far as I know the Player doesn't need extra activation. Will that stop with the full version too?

  • Kendall SearsKendall Sears Posts: 1,885
    edited December 1969

    Kerya said:
    ...
    I'm not going to get into an advertising war. The majority of your points are already available in the *FREE* player. And as soon as we can, will also be in the full version...

    As far as I know the Player doesn't need extra activation. Will that stop with the full version too?

    We're looking into alternatives that will also keep the pirates at bay.

    Since the Player is free, it doesn't matter.

    Kendall

  • KeryaKerya Posts: 7,241
    edited December 1969

    If you stop that activation, tell me - I am open to buy it as an alternative.
    (I do use different rendering software too ...)

  • GeddGedd Posts: 2,473
    edited December 1969

    Gone said:
    Normally, I try to avoid getting into these types of discussion because they require reasoned thinking and clear writing. I'm retired dammit!!! I don't want to spend my time creating a reasoned document and I certainly don't want to spend time debating it!

    Thank you for taking the time to put this together Gone, and for responding Kendal. This is exactly some of the information I've been looking for :)

  • Alessandro_AMAlessandro_AM Posts: 1,553
    edited December 1969

    Here comes a viewport screen cap and a 20 minutes test render of a 'furry dozen' done with latest player 1.06 version being submitted to DAZ as of today.
    It will add a whole new set of features like multifigure and geograft support, load and save to .duf files, animation capabilites and much more. We cleaned the code and fixed various bugs, and improved performances on several areas.
    I just wanted to clarify that all these changes will be obviously available in the full version update as well, which is currently beta testing and expected to be production ready very soon.

    furry_dozen_vp.jpg
    1775 x 925 - 285K
    furry_dozen_2b.jpg
    1298 x 802 - 635K
  • Carola OCarola O Posts: 1,689
    edited December 1969

    Is this the free player or the bought one? *curious*

  • Alessandro_AMAlessandro_AM Posts: 1,553
    edited May 2013

    Is this the free player or the bought one? *curious*

    As I wrote the render has been done with the player, which is and remains free. And of course the new features showcased in the player will be available in the upcoming full version update as well...

    Post edited by Alessandro_AM on
  • Carola OCarola O Posts: 1,689
    edited December 1969

    ah perfect :) I be trying it soon than. Thanks :)

  • Alessandro_AMAlessandro_AM Posts: 1,553
    edited December 1969

    ah perfect :) I be trying it soon than. Thanks :)

    You are welcome Carole :)

  • AdemnusAdemnus Posts: 611
    edited December 1969

    I own both garibaldi and LAMH, and Im having issues with LAMH. I had the player but when I installed the full LAMH the player is gone. I tried reinstalling the player and then I no longer had a "create LAMH object" in my menu ><

    Anyway, I like the ease of use of Garibaldi, but Im sure each has their good points so Im keeping both.

  • Alessandro_AMAlessandro_AM Posts: 1,553
    edited December 1969

    I own both garibaldi and LAMH, and Im having issues with LAMH. I had the player but when I installed the full LAMH the player is gone. I tried reinstalling the player and then I no longer had a "create LAMH object" in my menu ><

    Anyway, I like the ease of use of Garibaldi, but Im sure each has their good points so Im keeping both.

    Hi, as of today the LAMH free player and LAMH 1.0 cannot 'coexist', meaning that if you install the player, it will overwrite LAMH 1.0 library and viceversa.
    If you like to try the versions, you should backup the lamhplugin.dll of each version and replace it when necessary.
    This will be all gone as the LAMH 1.0 update will be released, since it will feature its own pane too.

  • GoneGone Posts: 633
    edited December 1969

    Personally, I'm not much interested in the player - especially with the co existance issue. But if the full version integrates as well as this appears to then you definately have my attention.

    Waiting patiently.

  • Alessandro_AMAlessandro_AM Posts: 1,553
    edited December 1969

    BTW, for the curious ones I forgot to mention that the overall hair count of the furry dozen is about 8,3 Million...

  • IceEmpressIceEmpress Posts: 520
    edited April 2014

    If you are using a machine with Intel Graphics, make sure that you have drivers newer than Dec 2012 installed.
    Aw, dammit! So it's not usable if we have a computer model from before 2012? :(
    Does this apply to the Garibaldi hair system as well?

    We test LAMH on a single core Windows XP machine with 1.5G of RAM.
    Wait, so which statement is true, then?

    I decided to go with Taozen’s suggestion, so I bought both LAMH and Garibaldi - on a trial basis, mind you! Whichever one I like better before the 30-day period runs out, I’ll keep; the other goes back for a refund. So I’m going to put them both to the acid test and see how well they do on a Gibson-girl hairstyle.
    They both have free trial versions?

    I have a feeling that LAMH would crash my DAZ-- I use 4.5 and I have found it impossible to convert the Chaos Seed gloves using Transfer Utility. (it freezes at 17%)
    Seems like one or two other gloves do this as well (they work fine with autofit, though)


    As for the differences, while both can do hair/fur, LAMH can be used for much more than just hair/fur. The 1.0 version can be used for grass, vegetation, condensation, sweat, and much more. The 1.06 version of the full plugin is imminent (now everyone knows one of the reasons for the delay) and as soon as we can get an “OK” from our testers, LAMH will do even more.
    Awesome. Can it make spanish moss? What about moss fronds? (think something similar to fern fronds-- if you live in the Pacific Northwest or in some boggy area then go outside, pick a single front off of some lush moss, ands look closely. BTW, the main stem of a moss frond is woody.)
    I'd really love to make curtains of spanish moss!

    I'd like to request though-- I'd... kinda like your honest (non-sales rep, like I've been seeing in pages 1-3) opinion on the comparison between the two though (pros and cons), if that's possible/okay. I mean, I'm sure you've played with the Garibaldi hair system half to death. And, as a word of encouragement (that you not just speak exclusively of the LAMH pros) I definitely consider the free LAMH player as a major pro (I consider freebies of any kind other than "you need my product-add ons" like free textures to be generous semi-advertising service to customers, and try to make a note of it and give stronger consideration towards purchasing the products of said PAs. Far more importantly, the LAMH team offers generous amounts of forum support.)

    Oh, one final and very important question-- how do the two programs work with each other-- what I mean is, if someone had both installed, would they interfere with each other/mess up DAZ Studio at all?
    Also, am I correct in assuming that both cannot be loaded into the same scene? (like, let's say you want a Garbibaldi express head of hair for M4, and a LAMH moustache)

    It should be noted that the Garibaldi author has said - several times - that his only interest is to make a ri-curves hair system for DS. Period. That could always change - but that’s the way I understand the situation at this time.

    The LAMH team have made it clear that they intend to push the technology as far as they can. Even version 1 has the ability to replace rendered hair with instanced objects. That, alone, makes the 2 products very different beasts.

    Ah. Well, I think that solidifies my decision on which one to buy/favor. I hope the Garibaldi team do change their minds-- I very much want to see and experience the full potential of both programs. I still hope that Allesandro and Kendall will answer my above questions, though.

    Against Lamh: there is an extra activation on Alessandros server, the serial number you get from Daz is not enough. (Which is why I will never get Lamh).
    So, are you saying that if the server ever goes down, I won't be able to register on a new computer after my old ones die? That sucks, and I hope the LAMH team will change this if ever they retire their server.

    Post edited by IceEmpress on
  • FixmypcmikeFixmypcmike Posts: 12,212
    edited December 1969

    opal42987 said:
    If you are using a machine with Intel Graphics, make sure that you have drivers newer than Dec 2012 installed.
    Aw, dammit! So it's not usable if we have a computer model from before 2012? :(
    Does this apply to the Garibaldi hair system as well?

    No, you just need to make sure your drivers are up-to-date.

    opal42987 said:
    I decided to go with Taozen’s suggestion, so I bought both LAMH and Garibaldi - on a trial basis, mind you! Whichever one I like better before the 30-day period runs out, I’ll keep; the other goes back for a refund. So I’m going to put them both to the acid test and see how well they do on a Gibson-girl hairstyle.
    They both have free trial versions?

    No, neither does, they're talking about the 30-day return policy.


    Oh, one final and very important question-- how do the two programs work with each other-- what I mean is, if someone had both installed, would they interfere with each other/mess up DAZ Studio at all?
    Also, am I correct in assuming that both cannot be loaded into the same scene? (like, let's say you want a Garbibaldi express head of hair for M4, and a LAMH moustache)

    You can have both installed but you can't use them both in the same scene AFAIK.


    Against Lamh: there is an extra activation on Alessandros server, the serial number you get from Daz is not enough. (Which is why I will never get Lamh).
    So, are you saying that if the server ever goes down, I won't be able to register on a new computer after my old ones die? That sucks, and I hope the LAMH team will change this if ever they retire their server.

    The server is paid up for 10 years in advance.

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