Is it just me... I just don't spend my money at Daz anymore

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  • trading-miketrading-mike Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Hello,
    yes, my spending dropped by at least 95%. It is not only due to Genesis (which would account for only 50% drop), but also that I really no longer want to endure those dreaded installers (they remember path, but always fall back to "Install for DAZ instead of Poser" and "create uninstaller". Almost every checkbox I have to change for every single run.)

    Then, there are not really any promos for Poser any more, and the DS images all look the same and cannot persuade me to buy.

    And yes, I agree, the new shop is a pain to use.

  • Serene NightSerene Night Posts: 5,549
    edited December 2012

    I'm spending less at DAZ these days, because they are producing less men's clothing and male characters. And just lots of outfits for the ladies. Case in point, the whole snowball savings sale has all been womens' things. I just don't need outfits for the ladies. I desperately need more guy stuff though.

    Post edited by Serene Night on
  • Herald of FireHerald of Fire Posts: 3,384
    edited December 2012

    If it's any consolation, I think I've bought enough in the last few weeks to make up for a few less sales. After picking up Genesis I went literally spend-crazy buying up every piece of Genesis related gear I could get. So great was my obsession that I nabbed the entire new Asian releases collection. I think I need to curb my spending a bit more in future though, as I've already got over 63 PAGES of available downloads.

    ...at least until they release a K4 morph for Genesis :D

    Post edited by Herald of Fire on
  • M F MM F M Posts: 1,371
    edited December 1969

    .... I think I need to curb my spending a bit more in future though, as I've already got over 63 PAGES of available downloads...

    The contents of the download pages aren't timing out properly - I'm at 127 pages o.0 (that's 10/page though ;-)... I'm not THAT bad!... I can stop any time - uhuh, yup, any time, absolutely... ooooh shiny! >_> ).

  • Herald of FireHerald of Fire Posts: 3,384
    edited December 1969

    M F M said:
    .... I think I need to curb my spending a bit more in future though, as I've already got over 63 PAGES of available downloads...

    The contents of the download pages aren't timing out properly - I'm at 127 pages o.0 (that's 10/page though ;-)... I'm not THAT bad!... I can stop any time - uhuh, yup, any time, absolutely... ooooh shiny! >_> ).
    Those are from the last four weeks alone.

  • IvyIvy Posts: 1,877
    edited December 1969

    I hope the daz people are reading this thread.
    when i seen this thread i looked at my spending and i too have spent about 90% less this year compared to last. here at daz. But my 3d expenditures are actually a little higher.. so I guess that means I spent more at other 3d sites. and I'll admitt it is a lot because of genesis, DUF and DSA files and poser compatibility issues.
    I think If Daz made it so Daz 4.5 could read and use .DAZ & .PZ3 files as it once did I think that would go along way to bring back daz to its former glory with poser users.
    One good thing though. Smith Micro has not changed. how you can use poser products. you can still use older version poser products in any version of poser. I wish Daz would have done the same with their programs and the products they sell . for me its hard to spend money on products not knowing if next month they come out with a new program that you can't use it in Or you have to have a ton of tools and fiddle-faddlery, No thanks
    I pretty much stuck to DAZ3A and P7 & PP2012 and buy for products that I can use in those programs. As I have stated many times.
    its nice to see I am not the only one who has the same feelings..

  • FixmypcmikeFixmypcmike Posts: 12,126
    edited December 1969

    Ivy said:

    I think If Daz made it so Daz 4.5 could read and use .DAZ & .PZ3 files as it once did I think that would go along way to bring back daz to its former glory with poser users.
    One good thing though. Smith Micro has not changed. how you can use poser products. you can still use older version poser products in any version of poser. I wish Daz would have done the same with their programs and the products they sell

    DS4.5 can read .DAZ and .PZ3 files. It won't write .DAZ files, but you can't read .DAZ files in a version earlier than the one it was saved in anyway. No version of DS writes .PZ3 files. You can still use older versions of products in DS4.5.

  • IvyIvy Posts: 1,877
    edited December 2012

    Ivy said:

    I think If Daz made it so Daz 4.5 could read and use .DAZ & .PZ3 files as it once did I think that would go along way to bring back daz to its former glory with poser users.
    One good thing though. Smith Micro has not changed. how you can use poser products. you can still use older version poser products in any version of poser. I wish Daz would have done the same with their programs and the products they sell

    DS4.5 can read .DAZ and .PZ3 files. It won't write .DAZ files, but you can't read .DAZ files in a version earlier than the one it was saved in anyway. No version of DS writes .PZ3 files. You can still use older versions of products in DS4.5.

    after re reading this post and what I wrote i removed .. because you properly would have.,
    so I'll leave like this. its not compatible with poser. end of story.

    As being a dumb blond I only buy what I can use easily.

    Post edited by Ivy on
  • PetraR123PetraR123 Posts: 199
    edited December 1969

    I started buying again and even renewed my PC Membership again since DSON came out and we can use Genesis in Poser:)
    There are still things I do not like much since they changed the Store but that is ok.

  • PendraiaPendraia Posts: 2,523
    edited December 1969

    I need to restrain my spending at the moment. I bought a gift card for $200 (cost $170) last week I currently have less than $30 left so just bought a new one to get the same deal. So many good products at the moment I'm finding it hard to not spend.

  • Herald of FireHerald of Fire Posts: 3,384
    edited December 1969

    Ivy said:
    Ivy said:

    I think If Daz made it so Daz 4.5 could read and use .DAZ & .PZ3 files as it once did I think that would go along way to bring back daz to its former glory with poser users.
    One good thing though. Smith Micro has not changed. how you can use poser products. you can still use older version poser products in any version of poser. I wish Daz would have done the same with their programs and the products they sell

    DS4.5 can read .DAZ and .PZ3 files. It won't write .DAZ files, but you can't read .DAZ files in a version earlier than the one it was saved in anyway. No version of DS writes .PZ3 files. You can still use older versions of products in DS4.5.

    after re reading this post and what I wrote i removed .. because you properly would have.,
    so I'll leave like this. its not compatible with poser. end of story.

    As being a dumb blond I only buy what I can use easily.

    I'm curious what issues you're having with Poser. I've imported a few of my scenes without much hassle, since I was a big user of Poser until recently switching to Daz. I've bought a lot of Genesis products lately, but the majority of my runtime is still Poser based, and all of it aside from the custom lighting can be imported into Daz without any hassle.

    If you're having troubles with particular products, it might help if you gave an example so that someone might be able to fix it, or help you better import them.

  • KickAir 8PKickAir 8P Posts: 1,843
    edited December 1969

    It may be my imagination, but has it gotten quieter?!? The forums seem slower, and not just that we're posting less but like there are fewer people posting . . . I don't mean from the software changeover in May (although I don't think they ever really recovered from that), but recently, in the last several weeks. It's almost eerie.

  • randym77randym77 Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    It may be my imagination, but has it gotten quieter?!? The forums seem slower, and not just that we're posting less but like there are fewer people posting . . . I don't mean from the software changeover in May (although I don't think they ever really recovered from that), but recently, in the last several weeks. It's almost eerie.

    I think that's normal for this time of year. People are busy with the holidays. Online posting drops off.

    It will pick up again in Jan./Feb. Typically with a lot more flamewars, since people will be going buggy from cabin fever.

    ;-)

  • TotteTotte Posts: 6,996
    edited December 1969

    It may be my imagination, but has it gotten quieter?!? The forums seem slower, and not just that we're posting less but like there are fewer people posting . . . I don't mean from the software changeover in May (although I don't think they ever really recovered from that), but recently, in the last several weeks. It's almost eerie.

    Everyone is trying to cut down christmas trees, wrapping gifts, those sort of things.

    And spendings, there has been lot's of great environment sets the past moths, but I agree about male outfits. Why are 80% of all fantasy outfits for females? I know Genesis is ambigenderous, but male fighters in high heels looks dreadfully right out stupid ;-)

  • IvyIvy Posts: 1,877
    edited December 1969

    Ivy said:
    Ivy said:

    I think If Daz made it so Daz 4.5 could read and use .DAZ & .PZ3 files as it once did I think that would go along way to bring back daz to its former glory with poser users.
    One good thing though. Smith Micro has not changed. how you can use poser products. you can still use older version poser products in any version of poser. I wish Daz would have done the same with their programs and the products they sell

    DS4.5 can read .DAZ and .PZ3 files. It won't write .DAZ files, but you can't read .DAZ files in a version earlier than the one it was saved in anyway. No version of DS writes .PZ3 files. You can still use older versions of products in DS4.5.

    after re reading this post and what I wrote i removed .. because you properly would have.,
    so I'll leave like this. its not compatible with poser. end of story.

    As being a dumb blond I only buy what I can use easily.

    I'm curious what issues you're having with Poser. I've imported a few of my scenes without much hassle, since I was a big user of Poser until recently switching to Daz. I've bought a lot of Genesis products lately, but the majority of my runtime is still Poser based, and all of it aside from the custom lighting can be imported into Daz without any hassle.

    If you're having troubles with particular products, it might help if you gave an example so that someone might be able to fix it, or help you better import them.

    There is lots I can list , But I don't want to start a poser/daz studio war thread that has been done already and they just get the thread locked.. this is why i delete my last comment. and I have learned some people love daz4 to a point they will say anything to defend it, properly because they don't work much with other 3d programs. or push the programs to do thing they are advertized to do such as animation. The only promising thing i seen with genesis is the super suit.

    and yes I do tend to run my mouth more than i should , lets just say I don't think someone ELSE would have started this thread if people were happy with daz and buying gen5 products like they did with gen4.
    I think my spending would have been more here at Daz.com if Genesis or gen 5 were not more difficult to use than gen4 , and I didn't need to have to do so many steps to get it to work. In Daz & poser with gen 4 we didn't have to work so hard to make it work (especially in animation)
    Daz may have fared better if people could use the Daz & poser legacy products in daz4 with out having to use goz or auto fit too ,( which i hate BTW) Trying to use Daz studio 4 in animation is slow and buggy, so not worth my effort in using it for ANIMATION, which is my primary interst in the daz program.
    There are many legacy FX tools that do not work in Daz4 , But still work in poser, even in pp2012 , I never understood why should a artist vender have to update their older works in order to work in a new program. They didn't have that problem with PP2012 when it came out. I can still use all legacy products with out a tools in order to make it work. could you image how bad sales would drop for Adobe if they Changed the Photoshop file format so you need a special tool in order to open and work with JPG & Png or Ai files. same differences with daz 3 and 4 in my opinion.

    Also in my opinion the daz4 UI (user interface) is terrible its can't be customized to suit my work style. Undocking tabs and trying to dock them else where is not the same as the daz3 UI. which i have set up very close to my poser. which is easier for work flow.

    I'll admit it I'm not a fan of genesis and seeming that this is what the artist and daz push to sells.They venders say that working with DUF files is easier. Well DUF maybe so easy to create clothing models But the DUF items won't work with gen4 and there for i can't use it and so I won't buy it. I don't need genesis to make art. if the artist venders want more sales they should make it in both .DAZ AND duf file format. even if it is a little more effort. venders at rendo make for both.and also offer their products with legacy shader maps along with the new SSS maps, some artist venders create products that work with both gen4 & gen5 with out tools.. I can't say I seen the same here at daz studio..com that is properly has hurt the sales the most.

    Those issues are what I have just with the Daz4 program.. do you really want me to list the problems I have with the Daz web site.?

    I set a fair amount of money aside for my 3D budget and I buy what i can feed Daz3a and Poser. with .DAZ & PZ3 files and screw the DUF & DSA files which I can not use with gen 4 or in poser without a stupid tool that is not easy to work with. and if that don't bother the Daz.com or sellers of this site that is great like i said I don't care where i spend my money.

    Have a nice day :)

  • TaozenTaozen Posts: 2,206
    edited December 1969

    It may be my imagination, but has it gotten quieter?!? The forums seem slower, and not just that we're posting less but like there are fewer people posting . . . I don't mean from the software changeover in May (although I don't think they ever really recovered from that), but recently, in the last several weeks. It's almost eerie.

    I have the same impression. But I've noticed there's been much less activity at Rendo also, for some time. The used to have 4-6000 members online most of the time, now it's long ago I've seen more than about 2000.

  • KickAir 8PKickAir 8P Posts: 1,843
    edited December 2012

    randym77 said:
    It may be my imagination, but has it gotten quieter?!? The forums seem slower, and not just that we're posting less but like there are fewer people posting . . . I don't mean from the software changeover in May (although I don't think they ever really recovered from that), but recently, in the last several weeks. It's almost eerie.

    I think that's normal for this time of year. People are busy with the holidays. Online posting drops off . . .

    A little, yeah, but nowhere near like this! Look at the PA's Christmas Freebie thread -- it's four days in, and only on page 10? Is that normal? Yeah it got a late start, but I'd think that'd give it a boost from the anticipation!

    Maybe it's technical -- I've done two thank-you posts in it, and the second one disappeared. But I'm not talking about just that . . . there's no official topic for the Snowball sale, and in the two adhoc topics nobody's posting renders. The one in the Commons is only at five pages and hasn't had a post in eight hours, which means nobody out here's talking about today's items.

    Back on topic, one of the Snowball Savings things is discounts on gift certificates -- I usually buy my DAZ budget in gift certificates for myself, so this is great for me, and I've already bought this and next month's. I'm thinking of doing it again out of my next paycheck . . . but if DAZ isn't going to be around for much longer that's not a good idea.

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    Post edited by KickAir 8P on
  • scorpioscorpio Posts: 3,833
    edited December 1969

    The drop in my spending has nothing to do with Genesis it is mainly due to finaces and the store mess.

    @ Ivy if you have no wish to start a flame war why do you insist on a long post saying how much better Poser is than DS and how some DS user are
    "and I have learned some people love daz4 to a point they will say anything to defend it, properly because they don’t work much with other 3d programs. or push the programs to do thing they are advertized to do such as animation." you insult DS user by making such a statement.
    I find Poser a pain to work with and not at all to my liking; DS I find easy but I don't think that this means that those who don't find it easy are lazy or stupid or inexperienced to me it just means they get that sort of system better than I do and vise a versa.
    There are several products at Daz that have been made for both Genesis and Gen 4
    There are several Poser products that do not work in earlier versions of Poser Miki 3 and Tyler or anything weightmapped for Poser or with Poser SSS maps.
    You prefer Poser so do many but many prefer DS, neither are wrong and neither deserve to be belittled because of their choice.

  • Serene NightSerene Night Posts: 5,549
    edited December 1969

    randym77 said:
    It may be my imagination, but has it gotten quieter?!? The forums seem slower, and not just that we're posting less but like there are fewer people posting . . . I don't mean from the software changeover in May (although I don't think they ever really recovered from that), but recently, in the last several weeks. It's almost eerie.

    I think that's normal for this time of year. People are busy with the holidays. Online posting drops off . . .

    A little, yeah, but nowhere near like this! Look at the PA's Christmas Freebie thread -- it's four days in, and only on page 10? Is that normal? Yeah it got a late start, but I'd think that'd give it a boost from the anticipation!.

    I do applaud the PA's for their generousity. I haven't posted there, because I really don't have anything to say. Truthfully, nothing given as a gift has been anything I have wanted, although I think it is a lovely idea.

  • MistyMistMistyMist Posts: 15,502
    edited December 1969

    it's been a slow year for M4 aficionados. the last M4 thing i bought was the ACIS outfit.

  • Serene NightSerene Night Posts: 5,549
    edited December 1969

    it's been a slow year for M4 aficionados. the last M4 thing i bought was the ACIS outfit.

    Its slow for Michael in general. A good year for Hiro fans, but, poor Michael.

  • scorpioscorpio Posts: 3,833
    edited December 1969

    Been slow for male stuff fullstop - as usual

  • Male-M3diaMale-M3dia Posts: 2,012
    edited December 1969

    it's been a slow year for M4 aficionados. the last M4 thing i bought was the ACIS outfit.

    Its slow for Michael in general. A good year for Hiro fans, but, poor Michael.

    I'd have to disagree with that. In comparison to previous years, it's been very good for M5. A bunch nice outfits, and with a little elbow grease, I've been putting outfits from other figures on him. Not to mention, I've been giving him a nice workout in zbrush and now that I'm a proud owner of Modo (it's 40% off until the 21st), I can have a some options for putting together more morphs and learn how to make some clothing for him too.

  • Herald of FireHerald of Fire Posts: 3,384
    edited December 1969

    Ivy said:
    Those issues are what I have just with the Daz4 program.. do you really want me to list the problems I have with the Daz web site.?

    I set a fair amount of money aside for my 3D budget and I buy what i can feed Daz3a and Poser. with .DAZ & PZ3 files and screw the DUF & DSA files which I can not use with gen 4 or in poser without a stupid tool that is not easy to work with. and if that don't bother the Daz.com or sellers of this site that is great like i said I don't care where i spend my money.

    Actually, I was just querying what Poser stuff worked with Daz and what didn't, since that was one of the arguments you made earlier. As an owner of both Poser and Daz Studio, it would have been useful to know what products to watch out for so as not to buy something which has compatibility issues. It was not an attempt at starting a Poser vs Daz flame war.

    I've used both. As a long time user of Poser I've been quite happy with the technology for the most part. I still have it installed on my machine and I still use it for some types of work as Daz lacks some of the tools that Poser has and vice versa. That being said, they both have their strong points. I could name countless arguments for and against the use of Poser just as I could list the pros and cons of Daz Studio but I won't because I recognize they're two very different beasts though they might perform similar tasks.

    What I am curious about, however, is why there is this great enmity for Genesis. As a user of Poser I have countless characters in my runtime and every outfit has to be specialized towards those characters. It's to this end I ended up buying the "CrossDresser" program which handily converts outfits from various models to others so I could increase the wardrobes of some less popular character models. As a consumer, it's quite useful to me to be able to purchase a single item knowing that it can be used universally whether my character is male, female, young or old. Likewise with those earlier models, character morphing is no where near as diverse. I see that as Genesis' greatest strength.

    I will admit I don't often do animations. My animations are often done through 3D Studio Max rather than Poser or Daz Studio simply because I have a greater degree of control over the final piece. With that said, I'm willing to concede that perhaps Genesis doesn't lend itself well to the movements and that perhaps Daz isn't as comprehensive as Poser when it comes to animating. I don't know, as I haven't tried to animate in Daz as of yet. Still, I don't understand why there is this huge divide.

    It's only natural that Daz will support their own products and try to build on their successes. With Genesis still being a fairly new addition to Daz's roster, and combined with the universal nature of all Genesis products, it's only to be expected that we'll see a lot of releases specifically for Genesis. Use them, or don't use them. Love them or hate them. But mocking a sound business practice makes little sense to me.

    There will always be those who covet Poser, and there will be those who covet Daz Studio. I consider myself to be lucky to have found both sides to be an enjoyable experience.

  • Serene NightSerene Night Posts: 5,549
    edited December 1969

    it's been a slow year for M4 aficionados. the last M4 thing i bought was the ACIS outfit.

    Its slow for Michael in general. A good year for Hiro fans, but, poor Michael.

    I'd have to disagree with that. In comparison to previous years, it's been very good for M5. A bunch nice outfits, and with a little elbow grease, I've been putting outfits from other figures on him. Not to mention, I've been giving him a nice workout in zbrush and now that I'm a proud owner of Modo (it's 40% off until the 21st), I can have a some options for putting together more morphs and learn how to make some clothing for him too.

    that's good to know. I can't compare to previous years, since I haven't been around that long. Only two years or so for me. However, in compared to Vicky, I still think Michael gets a lot less love. =-)

    I would love to see you do clothing. Your models are very wonderful. =-)

  • IvyIvy Posts: 1,877
    edited December 1969

    The drop in my spending has nothing to do with Genesis it is mainly due to finaces and the store mess.

    @ Ivy if you have no wish to start a flame war why do you insist on a long post saying how much better Poser is than DS and how some DS user are
    You prefer Poser so do many but many prefer DS, neither are wrong and neither deserve to be belittled because of their choice.


    I was not saying poser is better than daz. I've been working with daz since 2009, I lovedaz3 Daz 4 not so much. I also would love to be able to use some of the genesis clothing i seen in Daz.com store but can't because its not offered in the file format i use. and having to have a tool to make it work is not helpful in me buy the product.. I use
    those were my statements why I don't buy much here. not to start a another poser vs daz war. as i said in the beginning of my comment.

    I am fortunate to be able to set aside money every pay check for 3d art not everyone is able too.. but I'm not buying things i can't use. for the 2 similar programs, to satisfy another. that is just silly

  • gabugabu Posts: 262
    edited December 1969

    When I decided to get serious about 3D as hobby I joined the PC a year ago but it is unlikely I will renew when it expires in February.

    I like genesis and Studio 4.5 although I resisted the move for a while.

    But I am now buying next to nothing from DAZ - why?

    When I joined I didn't really have any firm idea of what sort of images I wanted to create but I now do (although that will probably change as I get more experience). I suppose you would call the category cyber punk or scifi punk and there is next to nothing that DAZ is releasing for genesis or gen4 that fits into that. All this wholesome 50's stuff that is currently coming out just repells me as well as most 'skankwear' (I think it has been called). I am spending my money elsewhere where there are PAs producing more 'edgy' stuff that I can use.

    I haven't used the PC coupon for several months now and I don't want to buy stuff just because it is a bargain and I can't see any use for it.

    It is a pity because I think DAZ needs our support.

  • IvyIvy Posts: 1,877
    edited December 1969

    Ivy said:
    Those issues are what I have just with the Daz4 program.. do you really want me to list the problems I have with the Daz web site.?

    I set a fair amount of money aside for my 3D budget and I buy what i can feed Daz3a and Poser. with .DAZ & PZ3 files and screw the DUF & DSA files which I can not use with gen 4 or in poser without a stupid tool that is not easy to work with. and if that don't bother the Daz.com or sellers of this site that is great like i said I don't care where i spend my money.

    Actually, I was just querying what Poser stuff worked with Daz and what didn't, since that was one of the arguments you made earlier. As an owner of both Poser and Daz Studio, it would have been useful to know what products to watch out for so as not to buy something which has compatibility issues. It was not an attempt at starting a Poser vs Daz flame war.

    I've used both. As a long time user of Poser I've been quite happy with the technology for the most part. I still have it installed on my machine and I still use it for some types of work as Daz lacks some of the tools that Poser has and vice versa. That being said, they both have their strong points. I could name countless arguments for and against the use of Poser just as I could list the pros and cons of Daz Studio but I won't because I recognize they're two very different beasts though they might perform similar tasks.

    What I am curious about, however, is why there is this great enmity for Genesis. As a user of Poser I have countless characters in my runtime and every outfit has to be specialized towards those characters. It's to this end I ended up buying the "CrossDresser" program which handily converts outfits from various models to others so I could increase the wardrobes of some less popular character models. As a consumer, it's quite useful to me to be able to purchase a single item knowing that it can be used universally whether my character is male, female, young or old. Likewise with those earlier models, character morphing is no where near as diverse. I see that as Genesis' greatest strength.

    I will admit I don't often do animations. My animations are often done through 3D Studio Max rather than Poser or Daz Studio simply because I have a greater degree of control over the final piece. With that said, I'm willing to concede that perhaps Genesis doesn't lend itself well to the movements and that perhaps Daz isn't as comprehensive as Poser when it comes to animating. I don't know, as I haven't tried to animate in Daz as of yet. Still, I don't understand why there is this huge divide.

    It's only natural that Daz will support their own products and try to build on their successes. With Genesis still being a fairly new addition to Daz's roster, and combined with the universal nature of all Genesis products, it's only to be expected that we'll see a lot of releases specifically for Genesis. Use them, or don't use them. Love them or hate them. But mocking a sound business practice makes little sense to me.

    There will always be those who covet Poser, and there will be those who covet Daz Studio. I consider myself to be lucky to have found both sides to be an enjoyable experience.

    I guess my issue genesis is the fact of how much harder it is to work with in animation and how little documentation or lack tech response i got whe i tried to get support when i was trying to learn it. that and the fact I paid for daz4 when the early adopter was offered, and then less than a month it was giving away...lol that was a burn.

    I love Daz3a it uses the same file format as my poser. Genesis does not, Animating well, autofit tool is a lot of work with gen4 models.
    I love poser. but poser can't use DUF files with out dson. and Daz3 can use DUF files at all even with dson. I use daz3a and poser and those are where my money goes.

    .

  • Herald of FireHerald of Fire Posts: 3,384
    edited December 1969

    Out of pure interest, what issues are present when working with Genesis models in animation? Should I decide to use them in future, it would help to know the potential pitfalls.

  • ManStanManStan Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    If you have the iconic shapes for genesis there is a big selection of steampunk outfits out there. Almost everything for the mil4 and mil3 figures will fit then.

    And there it is, autofit is good for us bad for DAZ. I have large wardrobes for most of my figures, most of which; thanks to auto fit, fit genesis, so no need to buy more clothes. The biggest reason I bought the iconic shapes was to drastically expand what clothes I could use on genesis.

    I'm working with genesis, but aside from the creature creator pack, there is little else I need for it. What has come out recently that I want are from stonemason and Jack ;)

    So far this year I haven't spent 10% of what I usually average.

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