Garibaldi Express: Hair and Fur Plugin Beta [Commercial]

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Comments

  • SpyroRueSpyroRue Posts: 4,923
    edited December 1969

    I have a request... For the next Beta.... Can we please have a 'save option'? It keeps crashing on me, and I was really close to completing a hair style, and then it crashed and I lost it. Ideally, I'd like to save my progress, so that should it crash I can load. Ds 4.5 very rarely crashes if ever for me, but its crashed every time I used Garibaldi :(

  • SpyroRueSpyroRue Posts: 4,923
    edited November 2012

    And a question for all the other testers here...

    Has anyone tackled the "crown" of the hair? I did, and made some good progress... There were several stray strands that refused to go down though, despite all nodes were laying flat. I also had trouble around the ears. some of the nodes got stuck inside them :S........... I played with the cut tool to try to clean the ears, but I wasn't able to cut the actual hair that was the trouble with the ears. Is there a way to trim individual loose strands of hair?

    Post edited by SpyroRue on
  • StevieCStevieC Posts: 44
    edited November 2012

    Found this forum, got caught up on all 27 pages, took everyone's advise and tips, and here is my first crack at the Garibaldi Hair system.....
    nothing spectacular, didn't even bother with adding any lighting, spent most of my time fiddling with all the sliders and controls in the styling and tweaking sections of Garibaldi, but I'm thoroughly loving it so far! Retired hairstylist here in the real world, so the comb and cut selections are going to be my favorites, as soon as I get the hang of the rest of it......I had a problem with the paint portion as well, but used a default Genesis for this, and applied shading, morphs and pose and expression after finishing the hair. This new plugin certainly has my vote! One question.....didn't try it yet, but is it possible to isolate sections of hair and apply different colors? If not, definitely something to add for a future beta release.....

    Garibaldi_Hair_Test_2b.jpg
    840 x 607 - 223K
    Post edited by StevieC on
  • Alisa Uh-LisaAlisa Uh-Lisa Posts: 1,248
    edited December 1969

    ....It gets to 99% and won't finish...

    Renders look great...
    Can you email me the scene and I'll have a look.
    Thanks

    Thanks! Will do so in the next few days - have company coming in the morning so am going a bit crazy trying to get ready. I did try different lights and that didn't help.

  • PendraiaPendraia Posts: 2,521
    edited December 1969

    I have tried a BUNCH of times to render the second image, and there are ALWAYS the same 2-4 squares (depending on the method - sprial, circular, horizontal, etc) that just will NOT render. It gets to 99% and won't finish, so I can't save as a png or anything else. Haven't a clue why this is happening or if it has ANYTHING to do with the plugin or if it's my computer. It's weird that it is the same squares every time. Tried cutting out some of the hairs in that section but it doesn't matter. I can't get these squares to render ARRRGH!!

    So I did some touchup in Photoshop with the clone tool, to try to hide them

    Anyway, here are my 2 attempts at the hair. Really loving it!!

    Hi Alisa, not sure if this will help but I do know that when I was doing displacement fur that increasing the bucket size would fix a similar issue. It may be worth trying.

    I was told by someoneat the time that it was likely a bug in the renderer causing the problem which I did report on mantis. Can't remember what happened though...it's a while back now!

  • gensigensi Posts: 7
    edited December 1969

    Spyro said:
    And a question for all the other testers here...

    Has anyone tackled the "crown" of the hair? I did, and made some good progress... There were several stray strands that refused to go down though, despite all nodes were laying flat. I also had trouble around the ears. some of the nodes got stuck inside them :S........... I played with the cut tool to try to clean the ears, but I wasn't able to cut the actual hair that was the trouble with the ears. Is there a way to trim individual loose strands of hair?


    I use the selection tool to select that strand, then just go crazy with the cutting tool to and draw all over that space to cut it all.

    Futurebiscuit,

    Maybe there can be a delete strand in the Style menu to be able to accurately get rid of the whole strand?

    gensi

  • Alisa Uh-LisaAlisa Uh-Lisa Posts: 1,248
    edited December 1969

    Pendraia said:
    I have tried a BUNCH of times to render the second image, and there are ALWAYS the same 2-4 squares (depending on the method - sprial, circular, horizontal, etc) that just will NOT render. It gets to 99% and won't finish, so I can't save as a png or anything else. Haven't a clue why this is happening or if it has ANYTHING to do with the plugin or if it's my computer. It's weird that it is the same squares every time. Tried cutting out some of the hairs in that section but it doesn't matter. I can't get these squares to render ARRRGH!!

    So I did some touchup in Photoshop with the clone tool, to try to hide them

    Anyway, here are my 2 attempts at the hair. Really loving it!!

    Hi Alisa, not sure if this will help but I do know that when I was doing displacement fur that increasing the bucket size would fix a similar issue. It may be worth trying.

    I was told by someoneat the time that it was likely a bug in the renderer causing the problem which I did report on mantis. Can't remember what happened though...it's a while back now!

    I'll try that, thanks!

  • KeryaKerya Posts: 7,185
    edited December 1969

    Spyro said:
    I have a request... For the next Beta.... Can we please have a 'save option'? It keeps crashing on me, and I was really close to completing a hair style, and then it crashed and I lost it. Ideally, I'd like to save my progress, so that should it crash I can load. Ds 4.5 very rarely crashes if ever for me, but its crashed every time I used Garibaldi :(

    For saving in between I just click accept, and back in DazStudio save as scene.
    As I am saving incrementally Scene01, scene02 and so on anyway, this is normal to me.

  • mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 7,187
    edited December 1969

    Pendraia said:
    I have tried a BUNCH of times to render the second image, and there are ALWAYS the same 2-4 squares (depending on the method - sprial, circular, horizontal, etc) that just will NOT render. It gets to 99% and won't finish, so I can't save as a png or anything else. Haven't a clue why this is happening or if it has ANYTHING to do with the plugin or if it's my computer. It's weird that it is the same squares every time. Tried cutting out some of the hairs in that section but it doesn't matter. I can't get these squares to render ARRRGH!!

    So I did some touchup in Photoshop with the clone tool, to try to hide them

    Anyway, here are my 2 attempts at the hair. Really loving it!!

    Hi Alisa, not sure if this will help but I do know that when I was doing displacement fur that increasing the bucket size would fix a similar issue. It may be worth trying.

    I was told by someoneat the time that it was likely a bug in the renderer causing the problem which I did report on mantis. Can't remember what happened though...it's a while back now!

    I'll try that, thanks!

    I remember that...

    There's a bit more to the 'problem', though...

    It's got to do with not only bucket size, but also render dimensions and 'partial' buckets.

    It shouldn't happen at any combination that results in 'full' buckets...so a bucket size of 16 and an image size of 1024 x 2048 would work., but a 1000 x 2000 would probably have the problem. It's most likely to occur when the displacement puts a pixel into the 'next' row/column and there isn't a full 'bucket' to handle it.

    Also, if that sweater is using a displacement map, it may be the cause, not the hair. Have you tried to render on an unclothed 'defait figure/

  • PendraiaPendraia Posts: 2,521
    edited December 1969

    mjc1016 said:
    Pendraia said:
    I have tried a BUNCH of times to render the second image, and there are ALWAYS the same 2-4 squares (depending on the method - sprial, circular, horizontal, etc) that just will NOT render. It gets to 99% and won't finish, so I can't save as a png or anything else. Haven't a clue why this is happening or if it has ANYTHING to do with the plugin or if it's my computer. It's weird that it is the same squares every time. Tried cutting out some of the hairs in that section but it doesn't matter. I can't get these squares to render ARRRGH!!

    So I did some touchup in Photoshop with the clone tool, to try to hide them

    Anyway, here are my 2 attempts at the hair. Really loving it!!

    Hi Alisa, not sure if this will help but I do know that when I was doing displacement fur that increasing the bucket size would fix a similar issue. It may be worth trying.

    I was told by someoneat the time that it was likely a bug in the renderer causing the problem which I did report on mantis. Can't remember what happened though...it's a while back now!

    I'll try that, thanks!

    I remember that...

    There's a bit more to the 'problem', though...

    It's got to do with not only bucket size, but also render dimensions and 'partial' buckets.

    It shouldn't happen at any combination that results in 'full' buckets...so a bucket size of 16 and an image size of 1024 x 2048 would work., but a 1000 x 2000 would probably have the problem. It's most likely to occur when the displacement puts a pixel into the 'next' row/column and there isn't a full 'bucket' to handle it.

    Also, if that sweater is using a displacement map, it may be the cause, not the hair. Have you tried to render on an unclothed 'defait figure/

    Interesting...I didn't realise it was due to the size of the render but that would make sense. Also that the sweater may be what's causing the issue...nice catch MJC!

  • mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 7,187
    edited December 1969

    Pendraia said:
    mjc1016 said:
    Pendraia said:
    I have tried a BUNCH of times to render the second image, and there are ALWAYS the same 2-4 squares (depending on the method - sprial, circular, horizontal, etc) that just will NOT render. It gets to 99% and won't finish, so I can't save as a png or anything else. Haven't a clue why this is happening or if it has ANYTHING to do with the plugin or if it's my computer. It's weird that it is the same squares every time. Tried cutting out some of the hairs in that section but it doesn't matter. I can't get these squares to render ARRRGH!!

    So I did some touchup in Photoshop with the clone tool, to try to hide them

    Anyway, here are my 2 attempts at the hair. Really loving it!!

    Hi Alisa, not sure if this will help but I do know that when I was doing displacement fur that increasing the bucket size would fix a similar issue. It may be worth trying.

    I was told by someoneat the time that it was likely a bug in the renderer causing the problem which I did report on mantis. Can't remember what happened though...it's a while back now!

    I'll try that, thanks!

    I remember that...

    There's a bit more to the 'problem', though...

    It's got to do with not only bucket size, but also render dimensions and 'partial' buckets.

    It shouldn't happen at any combination that results in 'full' buckets...so a bucket size of 16 and an image size of 1024 x 2048 would work., but a 1000 x 2000 would probably have the problem. It's most likely to occur when the displacement puts a pixel into the 'next' row/column and there isn't a full 'bucket' to handle it.

    Also, if that sweater is using a displacement map, it may be the cause, not the hair. Have you tried to render on an unclothed 'defait figure/

    Interesting...I didn't realise it was due to the size of the render but that would make sense. Also that the sweater may be what's causing the issue...nice catch MJC!

    It's more to do with the buckets being 'whole' buckets...so as long as the render size and bucket size are evenly matched, there shouldn't be a problem. 'Power of 2' sizes work well...16, 32, 64 for bucket size and at least the perpendicular to 'bucket order' size should also be power of two...256, 512, 1024, 2048,,,,also, when evenly matched there may be a slight increase in render speed (I've never tested or seen it...but I haven't looked for it, either).

  • Fixme12Fixme12 Posts: 349
    edited November 2012

    fixme12 said:
    what about dynamic hair with gravity and collisions?

    To do hair dynamics 'well' it's a big project... arguably more complex than cloth simulation.

    Garibaldi Express version 1 is all about concentrating about building a foundation of all the tools you need to style and render realistic hair in daz studio.

    If you wish to animate your character then currently the hair will 'stick' to your characters surface.
    The output will render stable and flicker free.

    animate or pose (and manual fix everytime) with sticky hair, this isn't funny...
    that's what we have years ago in the first xbox/playstation console versions.
    even game engines of today almost don't use this anymore.
    it's just a pitty, but will wait for hair physics/dynamics Sooooon...?
    physics would make this hair tool for studio complete.
    'm pretty sure some developer would come with the physics studio solution Sooooon.
    physics are unthinkable today in animations.

    Post edited by Fixme12 on
  • SpyroRueSpyroRue Posts: 4,923
    edited December 1969

    Kerya said:
    Spyro said:
    I have a request... For the next Beta.... Can we please have a 'save option'? It keeps crashing on me, and I was really close to completing a hair style, and then it crashed and I lost it. Ideally, I'd like to save my progress, so that should it crash I can load. Ds 4.5 very rarely crashes if ever for me, but its crashed every time I used Garibaldi :(

    For saving in between I just click accept, and back in DazStudio save as scene.
    As I am saving incrementally Scene01, scene02 and so on anyway, this is normal to me.

    Ah thank you! I didn't know you could do that with the plug in. Thanks. Saving increments is norm for me too :)

  • Mustakettu85Mustakettu85 Posts: 857
    edited December 1969


    Garibaldi needs a graphics card that supports: hardware vertex/fragment shaders, framebuffer objects, and multisample antialiasing.
    This means things are unlikely to function well with ati/amd or nvdia cards older than 5 years old.


    With antialiasing off, Ge Force Go 7300 (like, seven years old?) handles the plugin fine.


    I've gotten pretty adept at using Blender's UV mapping, so remapping the older animals, for personal use wouldn't be too difficult...but distributing remaps that would make many of them more useful would be.

    Lyne distributes the remaps as an .uvs file for UVMapper Classic. http://www.lynescreations.com/lynesfree1.htm

  • futurebiscuitfuturebiscuit Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Spyro said:
    I have a request... For the next Beta.... Can we please have a 'save option'? It keeps crashing on me, and I was really close to completing a hair style, and then it crashed and I lost it. Ideally, I'd like to save my progress, so that should it crash I can load...

    Well, garibaldi nodes saves in the daz scene, I'm not sure why you would need a separate save function.
    The plan is kind of that the final release version won't crash... it would be much appreciated if you could email me the details of what actions cause garibaldi to crash for you.

  • futurebiscuitfuturebiscuit Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Spyro said:
    Is there a way to trim individual loose strands of hair?

    If you're finding it hard to comb style curves if they are spawned passing through the surface geometry then try turning of these options:
    Geometry Intersection check: if style curves control points are allowed to pass through the geometry when combing.
    Geometry Occlusion culling: if curves control points are editable that are obscured by the surface geometry when combing.
    If you require to remove any excess hair then paint the areas the follicles are spawned black in the density texture.

  • futurebiscuitfuturebiscuit Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    StevieC said:
    ... but is it possible to isolate sections of hair and apply different colors?

    You can by creating a colour paint texture map and set it as the base/tip colour of your hair in the distribution workspace.
    You can also export and import the texture and edit in an external image editor if desired...
    I believe that it's explained somewhere in a post in the thread...
    Real written documentation will be coming over the next few weeks as most of the outstanding issues are fixed.

    For that hair style you might want to give the auto parting feature a try. Just turn down the angle threshold in the auto parting option section of the style workspace. I find around 100 degrees is a setting that works well.

  • futurebiscuitfuturebiscuit Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    gensi said:
    Maybe there can be a delete strand in the Style menu to be able to accurately get rid of the whole strand?

    If you want to remove hair strands then you can edit the hair density map. If you find it hard to visualise where the hairs are in the paint workspace then there an option to view the style curves why painting.

  • StevieCStevieC Posts: 44
    edited December 1969

    Thank you for the quick responses.....will post more renders soon!

  • futurebiscuitfuturebiscuit Posts: 0
    edited November 2012

    With antialiasing off, Ge Force Go 7300 (like, seven years old?) handles the plugin fine.

    Well technically even older cards should work and when anti aliasing turned off these older cards may perform a reasonable amount.

    The thing is that I don't want have to support issues that might arise with these older cards and need to cut things off somewhere. If your willing to take the risk then garibaldi should work fine with your card. I need to be realistic and draw the line somewhere...
    So the official support is nvida/amd/ati/intel cards that support OpenGL 3.0 or above.

    I just bought a Radeon HD 2400 for 8gpb (13usd) to add to my nvidia geforce 8400 in my low end test machine. These are slowest OpenGL 3 cards you can basically buy and even the high res examples are reasonably functional with antialiasing turned on. (although I do need to fix a slight geometry shading issue with the old ati card).

    Post edited by futurebiscuit on
  • futurebiscuitfuturebiscuit Posts: 0
    edited November 2012

    Garibaldi Express Beta 6 has just been sent out to beta testers.

    Although this version fixes issues, adds some optimizations and also adds some minor features (check the included Readme text), they're a particular feature I would like to highlight for testing...

    Previously Garibaldi Express did various on the fly optimizations to try to reduce memory usage during rendering. But for Beta 6 this has been taken to the next level of sophistication with many new additional optimizations...

    To activate the new optimizations go into the 'Render Method' parameter in your daz studio nodes and change the value to 'Disk Cache'.
    The 'RAM Cache' option is basically the same render method from beta5 and is still the default.

    The plan for beta 7 is to make the 'Disk Cache' mode the default.

    Here is one of the existing examples rendered in Win XP 32bit with a peak memory usage of 735MB of memory.
    For comparision the same scene without the hair has a peak usage of 425MB of memory.

    (150918 Hairs with 5096805 verticies).

    (note that they're still outstanding issues with rendering rendering with 32bit windows and is not currently supported).

    screen01.JPG
    1627 x 986 - 231K
    Post edited by futurebiscuit on
  • MEC4DMEC4D Posts: 2,535
    edited December 1969

    I love the Beat 6 release , so smooth without any issues or crash , render fast 150K hair in 5 sec with shadow maps
    also used the disk cache !! great
    and my favorite tool allow me to work freely and style without any drag , I am already on win8 and so far did not noticed any major issues
    I will check out tomorrow the readme and make the tests you ask for to focus on

  • futurebiscuitfuturebiscuit Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Mec4D said:
    I love the Beat 6 release , so smooth without any issues or crash , render fast 150K hair in 5 sec with shadow maps
    also used the disk cache !! great
    and my favorite tool allow me to work freely and style without any drag , I am already on win8 and so far did not noticed any major issues
    I will check out tomorrow the readme and make the tests you ask for to focus on

    Welcome back... Hope you have recovered from the weather releated issues.
    5 seconds? what are you rendering?

  • PendraiaPendraia Posts: 2,521
    edited December 1969

    mjc1016 said:
    Pendraia said:
    mjc1016 said:
    Pendraia said:
    I have tried a BUNCH of times to render the second image, and there are ALWAYS the same 2-4 squares (depending on the method - sprial, circular, horizontal, etc) that just will NOT render. It gets to 99% and won't finish, so I can't save as a png or anything else. Haven't a clue why this is happening or if it has ANYTHING to do with the plugin or if it's my computer. It's weird that it is the same squares every time. Tried cutting out some of the hairs in that section but it doesn't matter. I can't get these squares to render ARRRGH!!

    So I did some touchup in Photoshop with the clone tool, to try to hide them

    Anyway, here are my 2 attempts at the hair. Really loving it!!

    Hi Alisa, not sure if this will help but I do know that when I was doing displacement fur that increasing the bucket size would fix a similar issue. It may be worth trying.

    I was told by someoneat the time that it was likely a bug in the renderer causing the problem which I did report on mantis. Can't remember what happened though...it's a while back now!

    I'll try that, thanks!

    I remember that...

    There's a bit more to the 'problem', though...

    It's got to do with not only bucket size, but also render dimensions and 'partial' buckets.

    It shouldn't happen at any combination that results in 'full' buckets...so a bucket size of 16 and an image size of 1024 x 2048 would work., but a 1000 x 2000 would probably have the problem. It's most likely to occur when the displacement puts a pixel into the 'next' row/column and there isn't a full 'bucket' to handle it.

    Also, if that sweater is using a displacement map, it may be the cause, not the hair. Have you tried to render on an unclothed 'defait figure/

    Interesting...I didn't realise it was due to the size of the render but that would make sense. Also that the sweater may be what's causing the issue...nice catch MJC!

    It's more to do with the buckets being 'whole' buckets...so as long as the render size and bucket size are evenly matched, there shouldn't be a problem. 'Power of 2' sizes work well...16, 32, 64 for bucket size and at least the perpendicular to 'bucket order' size should also be power of two...256, 512, 1024, 2048,,,,also, when evenly matched there may be a slight increase in render speed (I've never tested or seen it...but I haven't looked for it, either).

    lol...I did get that. Sorry if I explained myself badly my brain tends to be fried after working all day. I find that interesting I knew that was important for games that images were power of two...just didn't know it applied to DS also.

  • mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 7,187
    edited December 1969

    Pendraia said:
    It's more to do with the buckets being 'whole' buckets...so as long as the render size and bucket size are evenly matched, there shouldn't be a problem. 'Power of 2' sizes work well...16, 32, 64 for bucket size and at least the perpendicular to 'bucket order' size should also be power of two...256, 512, 1024, 2048,,,,also, when evenly matched there may be a slight increase in render speed (I've never tested or seen it...but I haven't looked for it, either).lol...I did get that. Sorry if I explained myself badly my brain tends to be fried after working all day. I find that interesting I knew that was important for games that images were power of two...just didn't know it applied to DS also.

    3Delight isn't 'strictly' stuck with power of two images and such (although, it seems to be more efficient that way), but it's easier to work out what the various sizes should be if that's what you use...

  • StevieCStevieC Posts: 44
    edited December 1969

    I don't know if this suggestion is possible, but how about a "twist" tool in the style section? Something that would twist sections of hair in a circular motion, to create spiral curls. If varying degrees of twist are added, one can create a braid effect with really tight twists, or even a dreaded hair look......just a thought. :)

  • MEC4DMEC4D Posts: 2,535
    edited December 1969

    Thanks, rendering yesterday my set 150.000 hair with shadow lmaps and 1 spot 500x650 small render
    also the brushes don;t hang on me and styling is very smooth
    I updated to last Nvidia beta driver it may be the reason also and win8 both improved the work with the plugin so much
    I just tried to kill it yesterday and did not succeed

    btw 1 question will be there other option to save the hair curves other than a scene ?
    I tried to save it as figure/prop it did loaded back, I could edit and style again but failed to generate clean and render the curves it was just blank .

    Mec4D said:
    I love the Beat 6 release , so smooth without any issues or crash , render fast 150K hair in 5 sec with shadow maps
    also used the disk cache !! great
    and my favorite tool allow me to work freely and style without any drag , I am already on win8 and so far did not noticed any major issues
    I will check out tomorrow the readme and make the tests you ask for to focus on

    Welcome back... Hope you have recovered from the weather releated issues.
    5 seconds? what are you rendering?

  • MEC4DMEC4D Posts: 2,535
    edited December 1969

    I was thinking about that yesterday I wish I had a twist brush as I use in Zbrush , life would be much easy while styling

    StevieC said:
    I don't know if this suggestion is possible, but how about a "twist" tool in the style section? Something that would twist sections of hair in a circular motion, to create spiral curls. If varying degrees of twist are added, one can create a braid effect with really tight twists, or even a dreaded hair look......just a thought. :)

  • SimonJMSimonJM Posts: 2,889
    edited November 2012

    A nice feature to have in the Style tab would be a 'select all'


    Ahh, ignore me ... no selection equates to a select all :)

    Post edited by SimonJM on
  • StevieCStevieC Posts: 44
    edited December 1969

    First decent render experimenting with the notion of movement and motion in hair. For the first time EVER, I can finally create the feeling of motion and movement in 3D hair! Experiencing a black out here, must conserve my laptop's battery, but more shots of this in the near future.....:)

    Garibaldi_Long_Blonde_tossed.jpg
    1024 x 1024 - 594K
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