Let's TALK ABOUT Superheroes/superheroines

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  • Knight22179Knight22179 Posts: 1,075
    edited December 1969

    TimG said:
    Bare legs and the stapless top on Wonder Woman never bothered me, unless it was drawn as a thong and the top was really low cut. Terry Dodson drew her fairly well covered and it looked good. I liked Power Girl's costume, too, especially how it was drawn by Amanda Conner.

    I don't like it when a female hero who isn't invulnerable is drawn showing a lot of skin, though. Huntress in hotpants and a belly shirt doesn't make sense. She should be wearing lightweight, flexible body armor.

    Amen to that! She's human for crying out loud and can't afford to slip up.

  • K T OngK T Ong Posts: 359
    edited December 1969

    THIS Wonder Woman is quite well-covered. :lol:

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  • TimbalesTimbales Posts: 1,218
    edited October 2012

    I like this - her bottom is covered, her breasts aren't in danger of popping out. It's sexy, but strong and looks like she can move well in it.

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    Post edited by Timbales on
  • shadowhawk1shadowhawk1 Posts: 906
    edited December 1969

    TimG said:
    Bare legs and the stapless top on Wonder Woman never bothered me, unless it was drawn as a thong and the top was really low cut. Terry Dodson drew her fairly well covered and it looked good. I liked Power Girl's costume, too, especially how it was drawn by Amanda Conner.

    I don't like it when a female hero who isn't invulnerable is drawn showing a lot of skin, though. Huntress in hotpants and a belly shirt doesn't make sense. She should be wearing lightweight, flexible body armor.

    Amen to that! She's human for crying out loud and can't afford to slip up.

    I always thought The Huntress should wear something along the likes of Batman's or Nightwing's armored outfits. Not only would it be more functional but to be honest she would look just as hot in a skin tight suit as she would half naked without exposing herself needlessly.

  • OdaaOdaa Posts: 249
    edited October 2012

    1. Which (or what sort of) superheroes/superheroines appeal the most to you, and why?

    As a kid, I had a bit of a crush on the Adam West Batman-an upright guy who had a fun life in a fun universe and was clearly enjoying himself, but never let any of that get in the way of being a gentleman or being a crimefighter, as the situation required.

    I like the Robert Downey Jr. Iron Man because he's fun and funny and brilliant and has all the toys, but the films acknowledge that he's pretty messed up in a lot of ways. I also read a lot of Arthurian knight stories growing up, and so the idea of this dysfunctional man who puts on armor to try and save the day and hold himself to a higher standard than before spoke to that side of me.

    I tend to be pretty tolerant of out-and-out vigilante crimefighters fighting mundane criminals, just because I understand the fears that led people to create heroes and anti-heroes like that. I was in my teens, commuting to high school on a train in a large, not-hugely-safe city in another country, the first time I saw the Dirty Harry movies. I'd love to see a rogue-vigilante movie starring the Anne Hathaway Catwoman.

    The recent Thor, Captain America, and Batman movies were all cases where I didn't feel that strongly about the main character but enjoyed the universes they inhabited and the points the filmmakers were trying to make.

    2. Which (or what sort of) superheroes/superheroines turn you off, and why?

    Social activist/social allegory superheroes. I'm here for the escapism, not to be preached at. I liked Wonder Woman better when she was Lynda Carter fighting Nazis/1970s mundanes with some sympathetic military guy loafing around in the background than when she's living among the Amazons and the fans are hyping the latter as some kind of feminist utopia (or are being annoyed at the writers for not portraying it that way). I tolerate the X-Men because they offset the preaching with alot of pure unadulterated superhero weirdness and soap opera.

    I don't like "superhero vs the military" storylines (unless you're the Ang Lee Hulk, featuring Sam Elliott as the world's most nuanced take on Gen. Ross), for reasons that are not appropriate to discuss on this forum.

    3. What sort of things do you look for in a superhero/ine? Is appearance everything to you, or how ‘badass’ s/he is (as in how good s/he is against his/her foes), or the kind of person s/he is (morally impeccable like Superman, or bad-tempered like the Hulk, or arrogant like Namor etc), or the concept of the superhero/ine (whether s/he’s a mutant, magic-based, uses all sorts of futuristic gadgets, is a god/dess etc), or a bit of all these?

    Entertainment value, really. I was only a moderate comics reader at best, but I've seen most of the mainstream superhero movies at the cheap theater (and sometimes the expensive theater) since Batman Forever. If the good guys are likable, the bad guys are bad, and the spectacles are spectacular, I go home happy. Appearance only matters if their outfits are some kind of power armor (which I like) or are vulgar enough (Batman and Robin, Halle Berry Catwoman) to where I'm uncomfortable watching them. I prefer that they not be too self-righteous, because while the old school of actors were fairly good at portraying people who were earnest and well-intentioned and generally decent without being overly pompous (George Reeves, Adam West, Lynda Carter, Bill Bixby), the new school are generally *not*.

    4. If YOU could have FOUR superpowers, what would they be?

    Iron Man's resources (brains, money, connections, trusted associates) plus Invisibility, plus a controllable form of the Hulkout (including the superjump/pseudoflight thing, and whatever it is that keeps the Hulk from actually killing innocent bystanders), plus magic hulk-resistant wardrobe.

    Post edited by Odaa on
  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 5,577
    edited December 1969

    K T Ong said:
    To Shadowhawk:

    Mind you, there have been guys dressed rather similarly to that! (Referring to the DZFashion suit.)

    Which would surely be fairer. If we're to dress up the gals in such deliciously provocative styles, why not the guys, too?

    And here I agree with Knight, it's just sexist that there wasn't a single female GL!

    I STILL love that cover. I loved Tyroc he was such an interesting character but ended up getting lost in the bunch and eventually they made some excuse and sent he and his people to another dimension iirc... He was like the 31st Century "Banshee" but sexier! :coolsmirk:

  • riftwitchriftwitch Posts: 1,045
    edited December 1969

    K T Ong said:
    BUT I LOVE THE EYE CANDY!! Seriously you do have a point, I love the look but as far as functionality I am sure that running or fighting in high heels would be a HUGE pain in the backside! You are right on all the exposed skin to an extent as well, but if you could wear something that would provide a distraction to the male libido while you are beating him to a pulp, it sounds like a check in the plus column to me. My biggest thing right now is the whole Boob window for Power Girl. I love her old costume and really like the direction of her new one, bring back the boob window and it would be perfect! I love the flat heels that are integrated into the suit!

    Shadowhawk, what do you think of guys wearing something that would provide a distraction to the female libido? :)

    While true, the original comic the show was based off of was pretty grim and had a bit of a noir feel to it.

    I know. That's why I specified the (early) cartoon series!

    I knew I was going to get asked that one! :facepalm: As long as I didn't have to wear it I think it would be fair, but how many how many female supervillians are out there that would require that kind of distraction? Not big on the whole speedo thing but hey everyone has their own sense of fashion right? You aren't going to ask me to wear the boob window leotard and high heels next are you? I would have to draw the line at that! I hear thongs are seriously uncomfortable! :cheezygrin:

    They're more comfortable than you might think. G-strings are actually better, though.

  • KatteyKattey Posts: 2,912
    edited December 1969

    K T Ong said:
    To Kattey:

    Hey, I like heroes/heroines who are funny or a bit crazy too, or whose stories feature such elements. Storylines which are overly serious or grim do turn me off -- life's hard enough without reading or viewing material of that nature to make it even more sour than it already is.

    Nextwave is almost absurd in this respect but it is very well written, so absurdity was never a problem for me with this series :)

    And black-white no-compromise morality-that-often-depends-on-dress-choices is an even greater turn-off for me, too, though more with respect to the story/setting than the individual hero/ine in my case. Stories featuring this betray an utter lack of imagination.


    In Freak's Squeele which is a comic about superheroes but not in conventional sense, there is precisely one guy like that. He is an angel and he is sort of a villain so I was only happy when he got the trashing he deserved:p

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 5,577
    edited December 1969

    This is one of my all time favorite covers. Issue #241 and throwing in #242 too. They are illustrated by James Sherman and Joe Rubinstein and of course features my fav Legionaire Cham on the first cover..... When these comics arrived to my house, back when I was in 11th grade living in Natrona Heights, PA I just stared at each one for like 10 minutes and finally realized that comic book art was just more than comic book art, it was hard core serious graphics that deserved more recognition than it was getting.

    Now in todays world we have heroes in comics, graphic novels, TV shows, movies, stickers, statues .... list goes on and on...

    I think every fan has a defining moment when their eyes just go wide and their brains just go into WOW overdrive....

    These two covers and issues that James and Joe drew of the Earth War Saga blew me out of the water. What really pissed me off was they handed the art chores over to Joe Staton and David Hunt and Murphy Anderson to finish it off and I was .... well I was really really pissed off! It's no wonder it was never compiled. The art went from excellent to very very cartoony. I still have those issues but when I pick them up to browse through I'm elated at the James and Joe issues but still cringe looking through the final 3 issues by Joe Staton and company.

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  • shadowhawk1shadowhawk1 Posts: 906
    edited December 1969

    riftwitch said:
    I knew I was going to get asked that one! :facepalm: As long as I didn't have to wear it I think it would be fair, but how many how many female supervillians are out there that would require that kind of distraction? Not big on the whole speedo thing but hey everyone has their own sense of fashion right? You aren't going to ask me to wear the boob window leotard and high heels next are you? I would have to draw the line at that! I hear thongs are seriously uncomfortable! :cheezygrin:

    They're more comfortable than you might think. G-strings are actually better, though.

    I will just take your word for it on that.

  • riftwitchriftwitch Posts: 1,045
    edited December 1969

    riftwitch said:
    I knew I was going to get asked that one! :facepalm: As long as I didn't have to wear it I think it would be fair, but how many how many female supervillians are out there that would require that kind of distraction? Not big on the whole speedo thing but hey everyone has their own sense of fashion right? You aren't going to ask me to wear the boob window leotard and high heels next are you? I would have to draw the line at that! I hear thongs are seriously uncomfortable! :cheezygrin:

    They're more comfortable than you might think. G-strings are actually better, though.

    I will just take your word for it on that.

    I'm actually basing that on my wife's comments about her bathing suits; I don't wear anything like that, and the world is a much better-looking place for it. I have done thong/g-string type bottoms on a few characters, but most of my female characters are a lot more covered. A lot depends upon the character's powers, and sometimes personality. I haven't done any male characters in anything quite that revealing, but I do have a few who are showing some skin. Conversely, some of my characters (both genders) are completely covered; most fall somewhere between those extremes.

  • shadowhawk1shadowhawk1 Posts: 906
    edited December 1969

    riftwitch said:
    riftwitch said:
    I knew I was going to get asked that one! :facepalm: As long as I didn't have to wear it I think it would be fair, but how many how many female supervillians are out there that would require that kind of distraction? Not big on the whole speedo thing but hey everyone has their own sense of fashion right? You aren't going to ask me to wear the boob window leotard and high heels next are you? I would have to draw the line at that! I hear thongs are seriously uncomfortable! :cheezygrin:

    They're more comfortable than you might think. G-strings are actually better, though.

    I will just take your word for it on that.

    I'm actually basing that on my wife's comments about her bathing suits; I don't wear anything like that, and the world is a much better-looking place for it. I have done thong/g-string type bottoms on a few characters, but most of my female characters are a lot more covered. A lot depends upon the character's powers, and sometimes personality. I haven't done any male characters in anything quite that revealing, but I do have a few who are showing some skin. Conversely, some of my characters (both genders) are completely covered; most fall somewhere between those extremes.

    :lol: OK I will take your wife's word for it then. I love a woman in a thong but as part of a superheroine uniform it is just wrong. Now if it were to go over a set of tights that wouldn't be as bothersome as seeing her fighting with her butt cheeks hanging out of her outfit. As crazy as it sounds I think a pair of boy-shorts is sexier than a thong, leaves more to the imagination.

  • K T OngK T Ong Posts: 359
    edited December 1969

    Odaa said:
    As a kid, I had a bit of a crush on the Adam West Batman-an upright guy who had a fun life in a fun universe and was clearly enjoying himself, but never let any of that get in the way of being a gentleman or being a crimefighter, as the situation required.

    I like the Robert Downey Jr. Iron Man because he's fun and funny and brilliant and has all the toys, but the films acknowledge that he's pretty messed up in a lot of ways. I also read a lot of Arthurian knight stories growing up, and so the idea of this dysfunctional man who puts on armor to try and save the day and hold himself to a higher standard than before spoke to that side of me.

    Seems I'm pretty much in agreement with you with respect to your tastes. I love my heroes and heroines (and their shows) fun and funny, too. That's why I loved the (early) He-Man, the Hanna-Barbera Superfriends series and the (early) Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles cartoon series.

    Seems heroes/heroines and shows like these are hardly to be found anymore nowadays, though -- it's all dark, brooding and heavy stuff. Wonder what the heck happened?

    Odaa said:
    I'm here for the escapism, not to be preached at.

    I suppose sometimes a bit of preaching can be good, depending on how it's done. Each episode of the early He-Man series gave a little moral lecture at the end. And I seriously thought some of the lessons were entirely invaluable, even for adults.

    I prefer that they not be too self-righteous, because while the old school of actors were fairly good at portraying people who were earnest and well-intentioned and generally decent without being overly pompous(George Reeves, Adam West, Lynda Carter, Bill Bixby), the new school are generally *not*.

    Makes you wonder why. Have people forgotten how to act? And that's why I mostly don't care much for TV and the cinema nowadays -- for me it's retro all the way...

  • K T OngK T Ong Posts: 359
    edited October 2012

    RAMWolff said:
    I STILL love that cover. I loved Tyroc he was such an interesting character but ended up getting lost in the bunch and eventually they made some excuse and sent he and his people to another dimension iirc... He was like the 31st Century "Banshee" but sexier! :coolsmirk:

    Wolff, could you tell me what Tyroc's powers were and roughly what the story was in the comic with that cover? I'd be most grateful. Never got to read it...

    I don't wear anything like that, and the world is a much better-looking place for it.

    Hey, pay the gym a regular visit and you might change your mind.

    I do go to the gym regularly -- precisely so I can make the world a better-looking place by putting on one of those things. %-P

    Post edited by K T Ong on
  • Rashad CarterRashad Carter Posts: 1,039
    edited December 1969

    Love this thread!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • K T OngK T Ong Posts: 359
    edited December 1969

    Love this thread!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Glad you do.:coolsmile:

    Still waiting for your super-improvements on Bryce, though, so I can use it to make some great scenes in which I can place some near-naked muscleboy heroes... Maybe two of them wrestling in the water near that beach...

  • K T OngK T Ong Posts: 359
    edited December 1969

    A book I recently came across...

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  • riftwitchriftwitch Posts: 1,045
    edited December 1969

    K T Ong said:
    RAMWolff said:
    I STILL love that cover. I loved Tyroc he was such an interesting character but ended up getting lost in the bunch and eventually they made some excuse and sent he and his people to another dimension iirc... He was like the 31st Century "Banshee" but sexier! :coolsmirk:

    Wolff, could you tell me what Tyroc's powers were and roughly what the story was in the comic with that cover? I'd be most grateful. Never got to read it...

    I don't wear anything like that, and the world is a much better-looking place for it.

    Hey, pay the gym a regular visit and you might change your mind.

    I do go to the gym regularly -- precisely so I can make the world a better-looking place by putting on one of those things. %-P

    Tyroc had sonics. A lot like Banshee in the X-Men.

    Even going to the gym won't undo the hair on my okole; and I'm not shaving it. (I can just see trying to explain to the other guys in the locker room why I'm shaving my butt...they think I'm weird enough as it is.)

  • riftwitchriftwitch Posts: 1,045
    edited December 1969

    K T Ong said:
    A book I recently came across...

    I've seen that before, but I've never read it. Do you have it? If so, is it worth picking up?

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 5,577
    edited December 1969

    RiftWitch answered the question about Tyroc.

    More info on him here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyroc

  • riftwitchriftwitch Posts: 1,045
    edited December 1969

    Odaa said:
    1. Which (or what sort of) superheroes/superheroines appeal the most to you, and why?

    As a kid, I had a bit of a crush on the Adam West Batman-an upright guy who had a fun life in a fun universe and was clearly enjoying himself, but never let any of that get in the way of being a gentleman or being a crimefighter, as the situation required.

    I like the Robert Downey Jr. Iron Man because he's fun and funny and brilliant and has all the toys, but the films acknowledge that he's pretty messed up in a lot of ways. I also read a lot of Arthurian knight stories growing up, and so the idea of this dysfunctional man who puts on armor to try and save the day and hold himself to a higher standard than before spoke to that side of me.

    I tend to be pretty tolerant of out-and-out vigilante crimefighters fighting mundane criminals, just because I understand the fears that led people to create heroes and anti-heroes like that. I was in my teens, commuting to high school on a train in a large, not-hugely-safe city in another country, the first time I saw the Dirty Harry movies. I'd love to see a rogue-vigilante movie starring the Anne Hathaway Catwoman.

    The recent Thor, Captain America, and Batman movies were all cases where I didn't feel that strongly about the main character but enjoyed the universes they inhabited and the points the filmmakers were trying to make.

    2. Which (or what sort of) superheroes/superheroines turn you off, and why?

    Social activist/social allegory superheroes. I'm here for the escapism, not to be preached at. I liked Wonder Woman better when she was Lynda Carter fighting Nazis/1970s mundanes with some sympathetic military guy loafing around in the background than when she's living among the Amazons and the fans are hyping the latter as some kind of feminist utopia (or are being annoyed at the writers for not portraying it that way). I tolerate the X-Men because they offset the preaching with alot of pure unadulterated superhero weirdness and soap opera.

    I don't like "superhero vs the military" storylines (unless you're the Ang Lee Hulk, featuring Sam Elliott as the world's most nuanced take on Gen. Ross), for reasons that are not appropriate to discuss on this forum.

    3. What sort of things do you look for in a superhero/ine? Is appearance everything to you, or how ‘badass’ s/he is (as in how good s/he is against his/her foes), or the kind of person s/he is (morally impeccable like Superman, or bad-tempered like the Hulk, or arrogant like Namor etc), or the concept of the superhero/ine (whether s/he’s a mutant, magic-based, uses all sorts of futuristic gadgets, is a god/dess etc), or a bit of all these?

    Entertainment value, really. I was only a moderate comics reader at best, but I've seen most of the mainstream superhero movies at the cheap theater (and sometimes the expensive theater) since Batman Forever. If the good guys are likable, the bad guys are bad, and the spectacles are spectacular, I go home happy. Appearance only matters if their outfits are some kind of power armor (which I like) or are vulgar enough (Batman and Robin, Halle Berry Catwoman) to where I'm uncomfortable watching them. I prefer that they not be too self-righteous, because while the old school of actors were fairly good at portraying people who were earnest and well-intentioned and generally decent without being overly pompous (George Reeves, Adam West, Lynda Carter, Bill Bixby), the new school are generally *not*.

    4. If YOU could have FOUR superpowers, what would they be?

    Iron Man's resources (brains, money, connections, trusted associates) plus Invisibility, plus a controllable form of the Hulkout (including the superjump/pseudoflight thing, and whatever it is that keeps the Hulk from actually killing innocent bystanders), plus magic hulk-resistant wardrobe.

    Yeah, I have to agree with the escapism idea. I hate it when writers change characters to espouse their personal beliefs. Animal Man becoming vegeterian is one that sticks out in my mind at the moment. The escapism was also hard to explain to coworkers who just don't get why I read fantasy & s-f, rather than 'realistic' novels. I live in the real world, at home, on the job, and everywhere else. I don't want my entertainment to just be more of that; I want something different. They don't get why I would spend two weeks at Pennsic, wearing Medieval garb, either. I doubt they would understand any explanation I could give them.

    As far as the Hulk-proof wardrobe, I seem to recall (at least in the older comics, I haven't read any in years) that no matter what color Bruce Banner's clothes were, after his transformation the Hulk's ripped pants were alway purple. A side effect of the gamma rays, perhaps? :)

  • riftwitchriftwitch Posts: 1,045
    edited December 1969

    RAMWolff said:
    RiftWitch answered the question about Tyroc.

    More info on him here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyroc

    Is he in the current Legion line-up? I haven't picked up many comics in the last few years, and since DC keeps changing their history, it's a bit hard to stay current. The Legion was always my favorite book.

  • K T OngK T Ong Posts: 359
    edited October 2012

    riftwitch said:
    Tyroc had sonics. A lot like Banshee in the X-Men.

    So that means he probably can bash up Venom easily, huh? ;-)

    Post edited by K T Ong on
  • K T OngK T Ong Posts: 359
    edited December 1969

    riftwitch said:
    K T Ong said:
    A book I recently came across...

    I've seen that before, but I've never read it. Do you have it? If so, is it worth picking up?

    Afraid I haven't read it or got it yet. As I said, I only came across it recently -- online. Might get and read it sometime in the future, though!

  • riftwitchriftwitch Posts: 1,045
    edited December 1969

    K T Ong said:
    riftwitch said:
    Tyroc had sonics. A lot like Banshee in the X-Men.

    So that means he probably can bash up Venom easily, huh? ;-)

    If Venom is vulnerable to sonics, I would guess so. I've never read any of the books with Venom in them.

    No, I don't look anything like the pic you posted. More like Dr. Evil (the Austin Powers foe, not the original one) with a beard. (Ok, I don't have the facial scar, either.)

  • K T OngK T Ong Posts: 359
    edited October 2012

    I actually mistakenly thought at first that that post on butt-shaving was by RAMWolff, so I placed that pic there to make fun of him. Then I realized my mistake, so I quickly removed the pic. My bad... :down:

    Post edited by K T Ong on
  • K T OngK T Ong Posts: 359
    edited December 1969

    riftwitch said:
    They don't get why I would spend two weeks at Pennsic, wearing Medieval garb, either. I doubt they would understand any explanation I could give them.

    You're a LARPer? :cheese:

  • riftwitchriftwitch Posts: 1,045
    edited December 1969

    K T Ong said:
    riftwitch said:
    They don't get why I would spend two weeks at Pennsic, wearing Medieval garb, either. I doubt they would understand any explanation I could give them.

    You're a LARPer? :cheese:

    Not really; I suppose you could say that the SCA is doing live-action role-playing, but I don't bother with the battles and such. I go for the classes, and seeing folks I only see once a year. I really like the socializing; I met my wife at an SCA event. It's nice that Pennsic, the largest SCA event, is only a few minutes away from where I live; some people come literally from all over the world.

  • riftwitchriftwitch Posts: 1,045
    edited December 1969

    K T Ong said:
    I actually mistakenly thought at first that that post on butt-shaving was by RAMWolff, so I placed that pic there to make fun of him. Then I realized my mistake, so I quickly removed the pic. My bad... :down:

    No harm done. Just for the heck of it, here's a link to a page with a picture of the original Dr. Evil: http://www.toysyouhad.com/Captainaction.htm#DrEvil . (Weird, the link is going to the Captain Action page; there is a link further down on the page. Does anyone else remember him? He was the foe of Captain Action; DC did a short-run licensed Captain Action comic back in the day.

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 5,577
    edited December 1969

    K T Ong said:
    I actually mistakenly thought at first that that post on butt-shaving was by RAMWolff, so I placed that pic there to make fun of him. Then I realized my mistake, so I quickly removed the pic. My bad... :down:

    Butt shaving in my house is a no no! YUK! Fuzzy butts UNITE! :P

    I dont' remember Tyroc being part of the current line up. DC has the whole of the team split into two books right now... "Legion of Super Heroes" and "Legion Lost"

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