Wonderous Wares - Realistic Glass Containers for Carrara and DS Coming Soon (Commercial)

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Comments

  • DimensionTheoryDimensionTheory Posts: 346
    edited June 2012

    Thank you Lei, The question regarding water levels was talked about a bit in this thread here...

    http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/2107/

    Short answer would be that doing adjustable water levels are a serious pain because of the contours in the containers. That's the sort of thing fluid sims are for.

    The term "Skydome" doesn't really mean that there has to be a sun and clouds in the scene, "Skydome" is used for any spherical object that's used to surround the whole scene with an environment texture. Those texture can be indoor textures, so there can be indoor "Skydomes" and there's actually one included in the set in the prebuilt scenes to get started with.

    Post edited by DimensionTheory on
  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 19,421
    edited December 1969

    The morph question was asked elsewhere, and the answer was no - because it would take multiple linked morphs to get the liquid to move in anything but a straight-sided tumbler.

    With reflection and refraction you really need something to reflect and refract - either the sky dome or some all-round scene.

  • LEI1LEI1 Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Thank you Lei, The question regarding water levels was talked about a bit in this thread here...

    http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/2107/

    Short answer would be that doing adjustable water levels are a serious pain because of the contours in the containers. That's the sort of thing fluid sims are for.

    The term "Skydome" doesn't really mean that there has to be a sun and clouds in the scene, "Skydome" is used for any spherical object that's used to surround the whole scene with an environment texture. Those texture can be indoor textures, so there can be indoor "Skydomes" and there's actually one included in the set in the prebuilt scenes to get started with.


    Thank you for the link! I've never used Hexagon so without some kind of tutorial, that solution would be a bit out of my reach ... and what program are you using for fluid simulation? Also thanks for the clarification on the Skydome thing, lol. That word has always thrown me! In my head what you described, I'd define as an environment sphere … whereas Skydome makes me think of some sort of sun/cloud IBL ... why, I actually don't know!

  • LEI1LEI1 Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    The morph question was asked elsewhere, and the answer was no - because it would take multiple linked morphs to get the liquid to move in anything but a straight-sided tumbler.

    With reflection and refraction you really need something to reflect and refract - either the sky dome or some all-round scene.

    Thanks for the RE Richard. I checked out that other thread about morphing, but I don't think I can swing the Hex solution - as I've never used that program before. BUT at least there's some sort of work around out there … Skydome thing was also cleared up, now that I realize it's the same thing as what I've been calling an environment sphere for ages lol.

  • Age of ArmourAge of Armour Posts: 426
    edited June 2012

    Yeah, understand that an environment sphere/sky dome is not really required. As Richard pointed out the containers just need stuff around them to reflect and refract. If you have a fairly encompassing scene having a sky dome won't make much of a difference. We just wanted to point it out and include an example scene so that people didn't the impression they look like that if you drop them in a totally blank scene.


    Because so many reflective things we see in the store use mapped reflections, which don't require other objects to provide reflections, we needed to point out these were different. We toyed with doing these with mapped reflections but the results simply weren't impressive so we made the shaders to use only raytracing.


    This set includes a scene with sky dome/environment sphere. Feel free to save it and use it in other scenes too. But, an easy, general purpose alternative, any time you have a need for a sky dome, is to just load a large sphere or cube primitive (Create menu - New primitive). Move it down so the sphere or cube is roughly centered around your scene then, in the parameters tab just turn off "cast shadows" for it.


    With that you can drop in any image into the primitive's diffuse slot, set the diffuse strength to 0% then set the ambient to white and 100% strength. Sounds strange but it works well. Photos of scenes with lots of lights or lots of varying patterns often look good for scenes with lots of reflections. I'm working on some tutorials that cover this and will go into a lot more detail.

    Post edited by Age of Armour on
  • KasheeraKasheera Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    I was really excited about your Wonderous Wares and purchased it as soon as it was available. It's gorgeous. I'm having trouble using it in Reality though and am hoping you can help. When I render the sample scene using Reality, I get black glasses with just a sliver of color along one of the outside edges. Could you tell me what to do so that I get the same look you get in your sample pictures? I did try to send you a pm, but Daz refused to send it.

    Thank you so much for making such a beautiful product and for any help you can give.

  • Age of ArmourAge of Armour Posts: 426
    edited June 2012

    Kasheera said:
    I was really excited about your Wonderous Wares and purchased it as soon as it was available. It's gorgeous. I'm having trouble using it in Reality though and am hoping you can help. When I render the sample scene using Reality, I get black glasses with just a sliver of color along one of the outside edges. Could you tell me what to do so that I get the same look you get in your sample pictures? I did try to send you a pm, but Daz refused to send it.

    Thank you so much for making such a beautiful product and for any help you can give.


    Doh! Sorry for taking so long to reply. I still haven't gotten quite used to the new forums.


    All the promos were done in Daz Studio or Carrara without any special plugins. I didn't test the containers in Reality though I suspect they should still work. Using the example scene in Reality might be a different story though. I believe special, Reality lights need to be used for scenes which are to be rendered with Lux. The sky dome might be shadowing the whole scene in reality too.


    My old computer died a few months back and I still haven't gotten around to installing Lux and Reality on this new one. I'll try to do that this weekend and see what the issue might be.


    Oh, on another note, I want to point out that DT and I weren't trying to shun Poser users by not including Poser versions of the containers. Quite the opposite. They were set up as Poser props before doing the DS versions but the materials were fairly complex and Poser kept crashing while setting them up. For stability we determined that we simply had to drop the Poser versions and Focus on Carrara and DS.


    Please forgive my slow reply.

    Post edited by Age of Armour on
  • KasheeraKasheera Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Thanks so much for the reply! I've been working with Wonderous Wares now for about a week and still no luck. I'm fairly certain it is me, but all I get when I render in Reality is a black vase. I'll anxiously await your test and advice. I'll keep trying in the meantime!

  • KasheeraKasheera Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Did you figure any solutions out so I can use the wonderous wares with Reality/Lux? I'm trying to patiently wait for your input. I still haven't been able to get it to work.

  • DimensionTheoryDimensionTheory Posts: 346
    edited July 2012

    I'm sorry, we've both been talking about it and a Reality version would need completely reworked textures to handle transparency in a similar way to the DS versions. It would also need it's own set of shaders for both the glass and liquids, probably another 35% worth of the work that's already gone into the set. I'll mess around with the idea of a small addon which adds support, possibly for Octane too, but it would have to be separate to justify the amount of extra work it'd take.

    My apologies.

    Post edited by DimensionTheory on
  • PendraiaPendraia Posts: 2,522
    edited December 1969

    Beautiful work! It went straight in my trolley....

    Haven't been around much so this was the first time I found this thread.

    Hugs

    Pen

  • pcicconepciccone Posts: 434
    edited July 2012

    I'm sorry, we've both been talking about it and a Reality version would need completely reworked textures to handle transparency in a similar way to the DS versions. It would also need it's own set of shaders for both the glass and liquids, probably another 35% worth of the work that's already gone into the set.

    Hi DT.
    The only thing that we need for the vases to work well in Reality/Lux is to have proper textures for the transmission channel. No special shaders are needed and no alpha map, obviously. Just set the material to Glass, no archi, no hyper, and it will be working well. Very dark textures occlude the light too much because of the thickness of the glass, which is taken in account by the renderer. If you want to get fancy you can play with the reflection texture but it's probably not necessary.

    Cheers.

    Post edited by pciccone on
  • Divone LeradeDivone Lerade Posts: 4
    edited December 1969

    The product looks gorgeous but I am having the same problem as the girl doing it in reality except, it does it for me in DAZ. When I try to render, it comes out solid and almost black. I haven't changed any settings. Is there a trick to it? I can switch the reflection mode from raytraced to environment to get a translucent glass but I lose that lovely color seen in the promo pictures.

    Thanks in advance!

  • JOdelJOdel Posts: 2,081
    edited December 1969

    Are you working in a skydome? Glass shaders seem to need one or you get solid black glass.

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 19,421
    edited December 1969

    Are you using DS4.5? There seems to be a bug, in DS or 3Delight, when refraction affects a ray more than twice (as is likely to happen here).

  • Divone LeradeDivone Lerade Posts: 4
    edited December 1969

    I use DAZ 4.0. I have the skydome on. I used the preset to show what I mean.

    I'm sure it's just something I'm not doing but I'm stumped.

    wonderouswares.jpg
    1265 x 867 - 400K
  • Divone LeradeDivone Lerade Posts: 4
    edited December 1969

    Still not having any luck gettting those beautiful results with the transparent glasses. I have the product in an enclosed environment. Tricks to get it to work? Anyone?

  • KhoryKhory Posts: 2,538
    edited December 1969

    You need to have enough lighting in the scene as well so try some other lighting set ups.

  • Divone LeradeDivone Lerade Posts: 4
    edited December 1969

    Environment 2 isn't enough lighting?

  • SkirikiSkiriki Posts: 4,740
    edited December 1969

    Um, no, usually not. Can you add a spotlight, using the point of view shown in your render above?

  • edited December 1969

    One thing I've noticed when checking the diffuse for the transparent glasses is that it's all black with no texture map is that how it's supposed to be?
    Also silly question but we don't install the carrara file unless we have carrara correct?

  • mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 7,276
    edited December 1969

    SGeisha said:
    One thing I've noticed when checking the diffuse for the transparent glasses is that it's all black with no texture map is that how it's supposed to be?
    Also silly question but we don't install the carrara file unless we have carrara correct?

    With most true glass 3Delight/RSL shaders, that is exactly correct...the diffuse is either on (white) or off (black) and in most cases it is 'off'.

    And, yes, if you don't have Carrara, you don't need those files.

  • edited December 2012

    mjc1016 said:
    SGeisha said:
    One thing I've noticed when checking the diffuse for the transparent glasses is that it's all black with no texture map is that how it's supposed to be?
    Also silly question but we don't install the carrara file unless we have carrara correct?

    With most true glass 3Delight/RSL shaders, that is exactly correct...the diffuse is either on (white) or off (black) and in most cases it is 'off'.

    And, yes, if you don't have Carrara, you don't need those files.

    Ah I see Thank you! the reason I ask is because I keep getting the black glass look, it's driving me crazy.
    However it could also be the version of DAZ Studio I'm using, is this product only supposed to be used in 4 or can you use it in DAZ Studio 3 if you don't mind me asking?

    Post edited by SeductiveGeisha_5dc2c13145 on
  • JOdelJOdel Posts: 2,081
    edited December 1969

    Are you using a skydome? Glass shaders seem to require them, otherwise you get lovely solid black glass.

  • mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 7,276
    edited December 2012

    SGeisha said:
    mjc1016 said:
    SGeisha said:
    One thing I've noticed when checking the diffuse for the transparent glasses is that it's all black with no texture map is that how it's supposed to be?
    Also silly question but we don't install the carrara file unless we have carrara correct?

    With most true glass 3Delight/RSL shaders, that is exactly correct...the diffuse is either on (white) or off (black) and in most cases it is 'off'.

    And, yes, if you don't have Carrara, you don't need those files.

    Ah I see Thank you! the reason I ask is because I keep getting the black glass look, it's driving me crazy.
    However it could also be the version of DAZ Studio I'm using, is this product only supposed to be used in 4 or can you use it in DAZ Studio 3 if you don't mind me asking?

    The most common cause of the 'black glass' look is an incomplete environment...if you don't have a well defined, 360 environment, then all the refraction/reflection and what not. The shader is doing exactly what it is supposed to be doing, except, that it is showing the 'gaps' in the world as null space (black). In 3Delight/Renderman renderers, black is off/null.

    So to get things to work properly, you need a ground and an enclosing sky...or 4 walls, a floor and a ceiling...

    I'm not sure how 'exact' the version needs to be for this. The basic functions that 3Delight needs have been in it for a long time...but while the shaders are often 'foreward' compatible (or can be recompiled for new versions of 3Delight) they often aren't backwards compatible.

    Post edited by mjc1016 on
  • DzFireDzFire Posts: 724
    edited December 2012

    The product looks gorgeous but I am having the same problem as the girl doing it in reality except, it does it for me in DAZ. When I try to render, it comes out solid and almost black. I haven't changed any settings. Is there a trick to it? I can switch the reflection mode from raytraced to environment to get a translucent glass but I lose that lovely color seen in the promo pictures.

    Thanks in advance!

    Can you post a picture of your render?

    Edit- Oh, I see it. What is your raytrace setting in your render settings? Remember, every time a ray goes into and out of the glass, that's two traces right there. So, in and out one side, in and out the other side, reflected back and another few in and outs, that's a raytrace setting of nine o.O

    Post edited by DzFire on
  • mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 7,276
    edited December 1969

    DzFire™ said:
    The product looks gorgeous but I am having the same problem as the girl doing it in reality except, it does it for me in DAZ. When I try to render, it comes out solid and almost black. I haven't changed any settings. Is there a trick to it? I can switch the reflection mode from raytraced to environment to get a translucent glass but I lose that lovely color seen in the promo pictures.

    Thanks in advance!

    Can you post a picture of your render?

    Edit- Oh, I see it. What is your raytrace setting in your render settings? Remember, every time a ray goes into and out of the glass, that's two traces right there. So, in and out one side, in and out the other side, reflected back and another few in and outs, that's a raytrace setting of nine o.O

    Also what version of DS...there was a raytracing bug with 3Delight that was fixed in version 4.5.1.6....

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