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How to capture Mimic data to NLA clip

Mosk the ScribeMosk the Scribe Posts: 888
edited December 1969 in Carrara Discussion

Hi. I'm using Carrara8.5 beta and Mimic for Carrara with the updated files for Genesis.
What's the best way to capture the mimc data (the sequence of Phonemes) into an NLA clip?

Here's what I've tried so far:

I brought in a lengthy clip (vocals from a song), and two subtracks, one called Phonemes and one called Gestures show up as expected in the Sequence area/timeline, under Genesis>Track.

If I look in my Clips area at bottom right of the interface (Instances/Objects/Shaders/Sounds/Clips), the Gestures track shows up as a clip which I can then add to my browser under clips for later use.

The Phonemes track does not show up, however.

I tried to select and copy/paste the phonemes into a new editable clip and save that as a new Master Clip - but none of the data is actually captured.

Is there a current bug in C8.5 preventing this or am I doing something wrong here?

I don't remember this (getting Mimic stuff into nla clips) being a problem in the past.

Thanks for any help.

Comments

  • 3DAGE3DAGE Posts: 3,311
    edited December 1969

    HI Mosk :)

    This is the way Mimic for Carrara works right now, and there's no ability to "capture" a set of concurrent NLA clips in a track and make them into a single CLIP or convert them to Keyframes.

    The vocalisation is created by using the Phonemes, which are actually a set of NLA Poses, rather than clips which explains why they're separate blocks, and can't be saved as a single clip.
    The gestures track is a keyframed animation, so it's a single NLA clip, but there's not much use in saving that.

    since NLA was added, I've been asking for the ability to create more complex animations by using Multiple NLA clips and poses in Multiple tracks and then "Merging" all of that animation data into a Single NLA clip which can be saved, and can be reloaded as key-frames, which could then be added to or adjusted.

    Mimic pro (for Daz / Poser figures) is still an easier option, since it creates a single Pz2 (animated pose) which can be loaded in and saved as a single NLA clip in carrara.

    but,... if you're making your own Carrara figure, Mimic for carrara is a much better thing to have, since you can create your own Phoneme poses easily.

    :)

  • Mosk the ScribeMosk the Scribe Posts: 888
    edited September 2012

    Thanks 3dAge.
    So close and yet so far . . .

    I have Mimic Pro as well, and it would certainly make things easier for me if I could use it to place Mimic Data into a portable clip.

    But Mimic Pro requires a cr2 file which Genesis doesn't come with.

    Is there any way you (or anyone else) knows of to use Genesis with Mimic Pro so that a single pz2 file could then be exported for use in Carrara with all the lip synch data?

    Is there some way to Create a cr2 file for genesis with Figure setup tools (and if so, could the lip synch data then be used on the original )non-cr2 based) Genesis figure back in carrara?

    Will make do with things as they are for the time being within Carrara itself.

    Thanks

    Post edited by Mosk the Scribe on
  • 0oseven0oseven Posts: 626
    edited December 1969

    Mosk the Scribe said:
    Thanks 3dAge.
    So close and yet so far . . .

    IBut Mimic Pro requires a cr2 file which Genesis doesn't come with.

    Is there any way you (or anyone else) knows of to use Genesis with Mimic Pro so that a single pz2 file could then be exported for use in Carrara with all the lip synch data?

    Will make do with things as they are for the time being within Carrara itself.

    Thanks

    If you are talking about using Daz Studio Mimic pro to make pz2 files for Genesis then the answer is NO .
    I have an on going thing with support and their answer is that DS Mimic Pro is unlikely to be updated in the forseeable future.
    Also I have these issues.

    pz2 files(lypsync) do not import properly into Carrara. Mouth ends up stretched and distorted (v4 and M4. )

    3dage suggests above that it works for him so I dont know why not for me.

    Daz 4.5 will not launch my DS mimic pro.(even after mapping th e directory.

    I concluded I should buy Mimic for Carrara - but reading above I'm wondering if it's that good. I mean if you cant "tweak" the created clips ( as you can in the DS version) or save out as a file to reload later - well !!!! Or have I misunderstood some of the above.

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 37,784
    edited December 1969

    the alternative which worked for me, is load a wav file in lipsync in Daz studio 4.5 and analyze it for Genesis
    save as a duf scene
    load that scene in Carrara and create a clip from that figure.
    I successfully reloaded it onto another figure with it's own keyframed aniblock importer motions converted and loaded as an nla too.
    just untick the head parts on one and the body parts on the other when creating the nla.
    I found this handy for several figures speaking in unison.

  • Mosk the ScribeMosk the Scribe Posts: 888
    edited December 1969

    wendy♥catz said:
    the alternative which worked for me, is load a wav file in lipsync in Daz studio 4.5 and analyze it for Genesis
    save as a duf scene
    load that scene in Carrara and create a clip from that figure.
    I successfully reloaded it onto another figure with it's own keyframed aniblock importer motions converted and loaded as an nla too.
    just untick the head parts on one and the body parts on the other when creating the nla.
    I found this handy for several figures speaking in unison.

    Hey Wendy -

    How do you load a wave file in Daz Studio 4.5 and analyze it for Genesis?
    Do you do this in the 32 bit version? (because I don't see an option for lip synching in the 64 bit version and Mimic Pro asks for a CR2 file, which Genesis doesn't have)

    Would love to hear if there's a simple enough workaround since having to do it all in place with Carrara (which won't let you capture as a single pz2 file or NLA) creates a lot of headaches.

    Thanks

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 37,784
    edited December 1969

    32 bit only,
    just under lipsync like any figure.
    save the plain grey genesis as a .duf scene to open in Carrara for less likelyhood of errors

  • Mosk the ScribeMosk the Scribe Posts: 888
    edited December 1969

    Excellent.

    DO you know if there's any problem having both the 32 and 64 bit versions installed on the same computer?

    And would I leave the default directory for content set to the same path for both versions (C:\users\rob\Documents\DAZ 3D\Studio\My Library?

    Thanks

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 37,784
    edited December 1969

    well I have both, DS4 for mimic, DS3 for dynamic cloth as well
    you cannot run both at once (textures vanish from your renders!)

  • Mosk the ScribeMosk the Scribe Posts: 888
    edited December 1969

    Hmm . . . no initial luck. I tried a simple scene in 32 bit DAZ 4.5 with Genesis and a default included sound file.

    Looked fine in DAZ. Captured as an aniblock, but lip synch didn't transfer to genesis when Aniblock imported to carrara (though head motions/gestures did)

    Tried using PFE Exporter, but that didn't bring in animation.

    And saved as DUF file, but that gave IO Error and wouldn't load.

    Will try again tomorrow. And welcome any tips that helped you get things working properly.

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 37,784
    edited December 1969

    only as a .duf SCENE worked
    none of the others (well a pz2 was deformed)

  • 0oseven0oseven Posts: 626
    edited September 2012

    wendy♥catz said:
    the alternative which worked for me, is load a wav file in lipsync in Daz studio 4.5 and analyze it for Genesis
    save as a duf scene
    load that scene in Carrara and create a clip from that figure.
    I successfully reloaded it onto another figure with it's own keyframed aniblock importer motions converted and loaded as an nla too.
    just untick the head parts on one and the body parts on the other when creating the nla.
    I found this handy for several figures speaking in unison.

    Hi wendy

    I know you have advised me on this before so thankyou but it just does not work.
    I made the file in DS4.5 32bit as you described ensuring genesis dmc loaded /jiggled the text then analysed/ witn all Gen selected saved out as a duf "scene" Are we supposed to save or export and vice versa open /import in in Carrara?

    I tried opening/importing in 3 versions Carrara 8 (32 and 64)including latest V172(the one where morphs dont work which I did because someone suggested I should install a fresh copy and to use the latest) but in all cases I get " there was an error"
    So I have to conclude something is wrong with my installations ?? ( maybe 4 Carraras and 4 Daz Studios is too many ha ha )

    Question - assuming the lypsync is transferred to Carrara and saved as a clip can you then open it to edit keyframes for tweaking the mouth morphs.
    I gather this CANT be done with the clips generated by Carrara's Mimic. - big weakness -

    EDIT --=Scrub the last sentence as I understand generated viseme clips CAN be edited in the usual fashion. ie convert clip to editable clip and scroll down to the key frames but dont know how successful this is. Maybe you can tell me

    Post edited by 0oseven on
  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 37,784
    edited December 1969

    I get an error randomly on some .duf files, esp props but others like Genesis in dynamic cloth or fully dressed load fine animated, with lipsync.
    no idea why or not.
    if it does not appear in the smart content browser I do file, import.
    grey Gen with lipsync loads fine and you can convert to nla and use it on another figure.
    no you cannot mimic plugin nla clips as there are many and they cannot be all selected and copied.

    I get stuff not working, Hexagon is my thorn in the side!

  • 3DAGE3DAGE Posts: 3,311
    edited December 1969

    HI Wendy :)

    Nice solution / workaround :)


    Hi 0oseven :)

    in the NLA track for the phonemes, each NLA pose, can be adjusted by simply shortening the length of the pose, which decreases the effect on the figure,. you can also create your own set of NLA poses, (by creating a "Snapshot" of the figure ( NLA pose) which can be used instead of the default ones.

    for example: if you made your own figure,. you can adjust the facial morphs, then create an NLA pose, name it, then set that up in the figures Mimic list of phonemes / visemes.

    Hope that makes sense :)

  • Mosk the ScribeMosk the Scribe Posts: 888
    edited December 1969

    Does anyone know if Mimic Live would offer a simple (albeit pricey) workaround?
    Can you successfully export that as a pz2 or save as an aniblock which can be successfully transferred to C8.5 and then put into an NLA clip?

    (I'm trying to figure out if I'd have any use for the live creation of a lip synched character - and fixing the carrara problem might nudge me in that direction at least enough to try it for a month and decide if it's worth keeping)

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