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AUGUST New Users Contest WIP Thread

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  • Scott LivingstonScott Livingston Posts: 4,331
    edited December 1969

    bluemoon said:
    Made a few changes to the lights, eleven of them and tried uber environment for ambient light.

    I would love some comments, plus or minus on what you think.


    This looks really cool...probably the best illustration of the DAZ Studio included content that I've seen! I do agree with TheSavage64 that it might be improved by having stronger lighting on the human than on the dragon. I also think it might be a bit oversaturated, and could be improved by toning down the colors a bit, but that might fall into the category of personal preference. You might take the render into Photoshop or GIMP and play with the brightness, contrast, hue, saturation, etc. to see if there's another look you prefer--then you can either keep the postworked version, or go back to DS and change the lighting to match. Nice work overall and I'm looking forward to seeing where you go with it.
  • SasjeSasje Posts: 835
    edited December 1969

    Scott-Livingston said:
    Well, since we're a third of the way through the contest, I thought I'd better post something, even if it's still a very rough WIP. I'm struggling a bit with this one, though it's the composition more than the DOF. I may try a lower, tighter camera angle, even if it means moving some of the figures around to make them fit the scene. There are no lights yet, and the render settings are still at default/draft levels. Think I'll let this one sit for a couple of days and maybe start the other project I had in mind for this contest. I'd be happy to hear any thoughts on it.

    By the way, I'm glad to see so much Bryce stuff this month. Free Bryce was actually what brought me here in the first place. I'd never even heard of DS but I was hooked on it immediately...and, after completing your basic "tree on an island" render when I first installed Bryce, I haven't even opened it since. I'm looking forward to giving it another try, and really learning to do landscapes. Probably not for this contest, though.


    When I saw you’re scene, maybe you can do a few people in the front by the fence
    Do some stretch exercise and a few people in the back, side , middle talk to each other
    ore watching the landscape or something.
    And the DOF focus more in the middle and the front.
    This is just an idea what I saw in your scene.
  • Scott LivingstonScott Livingston Posts: 4,331
    edited December 1969

    evilproducer said:
    I know this contest is about the DOF in your render camera, but there are also ways- maybe even faster ways- to get a nice DOF other than from within your 3D program. Carrara Pro has different "passes" you can render. For DOF a good one to use is a depth pass, which can be used in Photoshop or other graphics programs as a mask.


    Please forgive me if I use the wrong jargon for this: In the following example, I set Carrara to render the image and a depth pass. In Photoshop I pasted the rendered image so that I had two layers. The top layer I added a layer mask and pasted the depth pass into it. I had to invert the image so that black was white and white was black. The bottom image I used a gaussian blur of three or four pixels. I did have to do some brightness and contrast adjustments to the layer mask depth pass to get the dramatic effect I wanted. When I was happy with the look, I flattened the image and I was done.


    The first picture should be the final postworked DOF image, the second should be the depth pass (not inverted), the third shows the untouched, as-is rendered image.


    I don't own this product, so I can't check to see how it works, but I believe I've heard that with the Atmospheric Effects Cameras by AgeofArmour you can do depth passes in DAZ Studio, too. http://www.daz3d.com/shop/atmospheric-effects-cameras-for-daz-studio/

    Evilproducer, that's an awesome render, by the way! :)

  • Scott LivingstonScott Livingston Posts: 4,331
    edited December 1969

    Sasje said:
    Scott-Livingston said:
    Well, since we're a third of the way through the contest, I thought I'd better post something, even if it's still a very rough WIP. I'm struggling a bit with this one, though it's the composition more than the DOF. I may try a lower, tighter camera angle, even if it means moving some of the figures around to make them fit the scene. There are no lights yet, and the render settings are still at default/draft levels. Think I'll let this one sit for a couple of days and maybe start the other project I had in mind for this contest. I'd be happy to hear any thoughts on it.

    By the way, I'm glad to see so much Bryce stuff this month. Free Bryce was actually what brought me here in the first place. I'd never even heard of DS but I was hooked on it immediately...and, after completing your basic "tree on an island" render when I first installed Bryce, I haven't even opened it since. I'm looking forward to giving it another try, and really learning to do landscapes. Probably not for this contest, though.


    When I saw you’re scene, maybe you can do a few people in the front by the fence
    Do some stretch exercise and a few people in the back, side , middle talk to each other
    ore watching the landscape or something.
    And the DOF focus more in the middle and the front.
    This is just an idea what I saw in your scene.

    Thanks, I'll try that and see how it looks!
  • bluemoon_524a0e29babluemoon_524a0e29ba Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Thank-you for the comments Scott-Livingston.

    I have looked at this pic in Photoshop, Fireworks and windows picture manager and the colours look different in all of them.

    I like how it has turned out, with some very helpful advice, how do you see it?

    Dragon03.jpg
    800 x 1000 - 271K
  • Scott LivingstonScott Livingston Posts: 4,331
    edited December 1969

    Hmm, to be honest I don't like this one as much, actually. I mean, the human looks great, and the dragon looks great, and the lighting of each looks great--but because the lighting is so different between the two, in my opinion it hurts the sense of drama and menace by seeming to pull the dude out of the scene a bit, if you know what I mean...out of danger. I'd like to see a compromise between this and the last version.

  • bluemoon_524a0e29babluemoon_524a0e29ba Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Scott-Livingston said:
    Hmm, to be honest I don't like this one as much, actually. I mean, the human looks great, and the dragon looks great, and the lighting of each looks great--but because the lighting is so different between the two, in my opinion it hurts the sense of drama and menace by seeming to pull the dude out of the scene a bit, if you know what I mean...out of danger. I'd like to see a compromise between this and the last version.

    I think you might be right, I should have left the back light on the character as it was so he blends into the scene better.

  • JaderailJaderail Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    bluemoon said:
    Scott-Livingston said:
    Hmm, to be honest I don't like this one as much, actually. I mean, the human looks great, and the dragon looks great, and the lighting of each looks great--but because the lighting is so different between the two, in my opinion it hurts the sense of drama and menace by seeming to pull the dude out of the scene a bit, if you know what I mean...out of danger. I'd like to see a compromise between this and the last version.

    I think you might be right, I should have left the back light on the character as it was so he blends into the scene better.I disagree with the strong lighting on the character and the red rim lighting on his side he does blend into the scene very well. This lighting also makes the DOF stand out very well.

    Just my two cents.

  • frank0314frank0314 Posts: 13,383
    edited December 1969

    Agree. I think the lighting is perfect for that particular scene.

  • SasjeSasje Posts: 835
    edited December 1969

    I’m agree with Jaderail and Frank, I like it .
    And I love the eyes of the dragon.:)

  • darkgoddessnightdarkgoddessnight Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Well, I've never worked with depth of field before, so this was something completely new to me. I had to seriously wrack my brain for this one. I think I'm going to call it 'A Good Book' or maybe 'Flight of Fancy'. I was basically trying to capture my reader's mind drifting off into the world of her romance novel.

    I'm not sure if I'm done with it yet so any constructive critisism would be greatly appreciated :D

    AugustContest_-_A_Good_Book2.jpg
    618 x 800 - 308K
  • evilproducerevilproducer Posts: 9,040
    edited December 1969

    Scott-Livingston said:
    evilproducer said:
    I know this contest is about the DOF in your render camera, but there are also ways- maybe even faster ways- to get a nice DOF other than from within your 3D program. Carrara Pro has different "passes" you can render. For DOF a good one to use is a depth pass, which can be used in Photoshop or other graphics programs as a mask.


    Please forgive me if I use the wrong jargon for this: In the following example, I set Carrara to render the image and a depth pass. In Photoshop I pasted the rendered image so that I had two layers. The top layer I added a layer mask and pasted the depth pass into it. I had to invert the image so that black was white and white was black. The bottom image I used a gaussian blur of three or four pixels. I did have to do some brightness and contrast adjustments to the layer mask depth pass to get the dramatic effect I wanted. When I was happy with the look, I flattened the image and I was done.


    The first picture should be the final postworked DOF image, the second should be the depth pass (not inverted), the third shows the untouched, as-is rendered image.


    I don't own this product, so I can't check to see how it works, but I believe I've heard that with the Atmospheric Effects Cameras by AgeofArmour you can do depth passes in DAZ Studio, too. http://www.daz3d.com/shop/atmospheric-effects-cameras-for-daz-studio/

    Evilproducer, that's an awesome render, by the way! :)


    Thanks, I'm trying to decide how I want to do the lighting and add to the environment. I like the "dawn" feel of the lights, but think it could be better.

  • JaderailJaderail Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    darkgoddessnight said:
    Well, I've never worked with depth of field before, so this was something completely new to me. I had to seriously wrack my brain for this one. I think I'm going to call it 'A Good Book' or maybe 'Flight of Fancy'. I was basically trying to capture my reader's mind drifting off into the world of her romance novel.

    I'm not sure if I'm done with it yet so any constructive critisism would be greatly appreciated :D

    I like this very much. I'm not sure how to make it better. Maybe others could help but I do not see much to work on myself.
  • evilproducerevilproducer Posts: 9,040
    edited December 1969

    I seem to be in a Star Wars mood this month. I actually was looking for the ATAT and came across the fix that was done to convert PhilC's Leia slave outfit to V4. I figured what the heck, might as well try it out!


    This is was done using Carrara 7.2 Pro, and some postwork in Photoshop to enhance the DOF that I had set-up in Carrara.

    slave-leia01.jpg
    1500 x 2000 - 684K
  • JaderailJaderail Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    That's darn good work. Can the hair prop be moved? If so I think I would hide the end to the back. It kills the reality of the render.

  • evilproducerevilproducer Posts: 9,040
    edited December 1969

    Jaderail said:
    That's darn good work. Can the hair prop be moved? If so I think I would hide the end to the back. It kills the reality of the render.


    Good point! It looks a bit clay like! Normally I'd try dynamic hair first but I haven't figured out a way to do braids.

  • JaderailJaderail Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Hey, It's still a great render. And I loved seeing it at full rez for a change. I love the work on the Forums.

  • evilproducerevilproducer Posts: 9,040
    edited December 1969

    No problem. That's why it's a WIP thread. To tell the truth I also want to fix the teeth. They look coffee stained, probably the color I have set for the Sky Light which acts like an IBL in Carrara.

  • TeofaTeofa Posts: 823
    edited August 2012

    Well, as a former Diorama builder, I am used to faking DOF by other means.

    First version on Left, second on Right. I focused the lighting to decrease the background presence and added a couple small higher detailed bits of "flotsam" to the foreground.

    A guy told me once, that making a diorama scene was not tons of detail, but the illusion of it, and drawing the eye to what you want to be seen.

    But, I could be full of it. :) I know the contest is to encourage use of DOF tools, but I think both old and new methods in conjunction would be spiffy. Oh, and Im not entering, just being nosy.

    These images are not contest wips, they do not include the DOF camera tools.

    bughunt2.png
    530 x 716 - 446K
    bughunt.png
    530 x 716 - 525K
    Post edited by Teofa on
  • evilproducerevilproducer Posts: 9,040
    edited August 2012

    standfast said:
    Well, as a former Diorama builder, I am used to faking DOF by other means.

    Tell me what you think.

    First version on Left, second on Right. I focused the lighting to decrease the background presence and added a couple small higher detailed bits of "flotsam" to the foreground.

    A guy told me once, that making a diorama scene was not tons of detail, but the illusion of it, and drawing the eye to what you want to be seen.

    But, I could be full of it. :)


    I'm no stranger to forced perspective in my renders. Can come in very handy!


    It looks like your render uses a backdrop. Is it composited in post production, or rendered with the figure? I think the DOF they're looking for is the photographic effect of being focused on the subject, and the background or foreground (or both) is out of focus. You may be able to get that effect by softening the focus on the background image.

    Post edited by evilproducer on
  • TeofaTeofa Posts: 823
    edited August 2012

    evilproducer said:
    standfast said:
    Well, as a former Diorama builder, I am used to faking DOF by other means.

    Tell me what you think.

    First version on Left, second on Right. I focused the lighting to decrease the background presence and added a couple small higher detailed bits of "flotsam" to the foreground.

    A guy told me once, that making a diorama scene was not tons of detail, but the illusion of it, and drawing the eye to what you want to be seen.

    But, I could be full of it. :)


    I'm no stranger to forced perspective in my renders. Can come in very handy!


    It looks like your render uses a backdrop. Is it composited in post production, or rendered with the figure? I think the DOF they're looking for is the photographic effect of being focused on the subject, and the background or foreground (or both) is out of focus. You may be able to get that effect by softening the focus on the background image.

    All done in the Scene in-game. Exact same background plane in both images. I lost my photoshop due to an unfortunate bolt of lightning coming in on my phone line and frying everything. That backdrop is just a random bombed city image pulled off the internet raw. Not going to be doing a lot of post process effects with MSPaint.

    But yes.. the DOF they want is different, but my 2 cents is not to forget forcing. Just my background. Dioramas didnt have anything but light and shadow and forced perspective.

    Post edited by Teofa on
  • evilproducerevilproducer Posts: 9,040
    edited August 2012

    Good point. Forced perspective, with a properly set DOF can give a great sense of depth. Must be careful to not over do it, or it'll look like miniatures.


    Edited to add that the lighting is very nice in your scene.

    Post edited by evilproducer on
  • JaderailJaderail Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    @standfast: I just have to point out that this contest is about using the DOF of the render camera. We would prefer to see a rendered background in the image that uses DOF and not a Postworked DOF image. We can tell the differance, and will exclude renders that do not use TRUE DOF in the submissions for the contest. If you just wish to give tips that is fine.

  • TeofaTeofa Posts: 823
    edited December 1969

    Ill just put it another way, looking at the wips so far, the most successful ones have a focused strong visual draw that pulls the viewers eye to it, forcing the viewers eye to create DOF. This makes the artificially rendered focus effects more effective and less manufactured looking, more natural.

    A couple of the Images I had to look for the focus setting effects.. and that is good. I was focused on the image they intended.

    The Magic wielder mage is very effective.. and the DOF effects natural. Princess Leia as well. The macrolens bugs work, but DOF effects like those work very well to replicate macrophotography. It is harder in the big scale, needing that "pow" visual grabber.

  • TeofaTeofa Posts: 823
    edited December 1969

    Jaderail said:
    @standfast: I just have to point out that this contest is about using the DOF of the render camera. We would prefer to see a rendered background in the image that uses DOF and not a Postworked DOF image. We can tell the differance, and will exclude renders that do not use TRUE DOF in the submissions for the contest. If you just wish to give tips that is fine.

    Oh sorry. I am not entering. I looked at all the entries so far and just wanted to somehow say that Render Camera DOF would be enhanced by composition, light, a strong focal point, and so on. I will be quiet now.

  • JaderailJaderail Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    I agree about the POW effect of DOF in a render. I only wished to point out that if you join the contest Rendered DOF was required. Please keep giving tips and pointers. I would like to invite you to join the contest also. You could win a nice prize just for trying.

  • Scott LivingstonScott Livingston Posts: 4,331
    edited December 1969

    Here's my second project for this month's contest. This one is going a little more smoothly and I'm having more fun with it, so I think I'll try to finish this first and then assess whether I want to go back to the other, or try a less complicated composition for my second entry.

    For this one, I do want to add some more elements to the background...the untextured Genesis is just standing in, so I can see how blurry things are back there. I know that the sky background will have to be blurred. The plan is to get the DOF and general framing figured out first, then add the rest of the scene elements and the lighting.

    What I would LIKE to do with the DOF is have a very tight focus on the female figure, with the male in the foreground slightly out-of-focus, and the background elements out-of-focus, but with details still discernible. Not quite sure how to make that happen, or whether it's even possible without shifting things around. I haven't been able to blur the focus on the male without totally losing the background.

    Current DOF settings: focal length 35, focal distance 255, f-stop 20.

    neanderthalmuseum1h-flen35-fdist255-fstop20.jpg
    800 x 800 - 355K
  • bluemoon_524a0e29babluemoon_524a0e29ba Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    I disagree with the strong lighting on the character and the red rim lighting on his side he does blend into the scene very well. This lighting also makes the DOF stand out very well.

    Just my two cents.
    Thank you Jaderail.

    Agree. I think the lighting is perfect for that particular scene.

    Thank you Frank0314.
    I’m agree with Jaderail and Frank, I like it .
    And I love the eyes of the dragon.
    Thank you Sasje.
    I am not getting notified when there are new posts.
  • bluemoon_524a0e29babluemoon_524a0e29ba Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    I have been working on this one for two days now. What do you think of the test render.

    crates-02.jpg
    800 x 961 - 237K
  • frank0314frank0314 Posts: 13,383
    edited December 1969

    I really like that one bluemoon. I don't personally see much room for improvement

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