why is the DAZ store so expensive?
XoechZ
Posts: 1,102
Not talking about new stuff, which everyone wants to have. But take a look at older things, especially clothes for Victoria 4. These are still way too expensive in my eyes. Why is that so? Most of the old V4 clothes are still in the 20 $ range - or more.
Looking at other shops, I see that I can get similar clothes for V4 with the same (or even better) quality for less than 10 $. So why should I buy here? I think DAZ should be aware of that.
What do you think?
Post edited by XoechZ on
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You want to talk expensive have a gander at turbosquid. http://www.turbosquid.com/Search/3D-Models/People
Daz prices have always been very reasonable for the work involved to create them.
Guess we are seeing different stores, because I see just the opposite around the web. While there are a few vendors that are way overpriced here at DAZ, if you are patient and wait for sales, you can pretty much get the whole store at really low prices.
Quality here really depends on the vendor like at other stores, but for the most part it is pretty high.
In the context of 3d content, items for DS and Poser are VERY cheap compared to other stores, just look at Turbosquid which caters to a different client and use.
To be fair, try making your own quality content and you'll see how much work is involved.
Ok, I understand your point of view with the work involved.
What I wanted to point out is that there should be a difference between new content which is generally better selling and old content which is (I guess) almost not selling any more. Generally older items are always cheaper than newer items.
What do you think - or do you know - how many people still buy old and outdated clothes for V4? Especially if they still cost 20$ or more? Maybe people (like me) would still buy those things if they were cheaper.
This is my point of view and I hope you understand it too. I think this is normal economy thinking - push older stuff with lower prices. Not?
I do not think you should make the assumption that old products do not still sell well. Quality products have a long shelf life.
Usually here there is a price for an item and it stays at that price.
Perhaps because of the 30 days money back guarantee (if you buy something and in the next 30 days it is lower in price, you get the difference). In other stores there isn't any of that guarantee.
Just for fun: the older items here are for M2/V2 - and they DO sell:
http://www.daz3d.com/john-malis-1
DAZ Originals or PA products? Many of the DO's for V4 run list price under $20, some under $15. If you are PC member, you get an automatic 30% discount on all DAZ Original items. There are many items for V4 in the PC for $1.99.
If it is a PA product (one that does not list DAZ3D among the vendors) then the price is set by the PA. If you check fast grab daily, you will find many items for V4 and other figures for 70% off. In fact, there is an outfit for V4 in fast grab right now for $7 and change.
Are the products selling for under $10 at regular pricing or sale pricing? Clearance pricing at Rendo or Deep Freeze (permanent price reduction) at RDNA?
Most of the recently released items for V4 I've looked at over at Rendo have been carrying list prices close to the $20 mark. There are some PA items that I think are a bit over priced. One vendor has an entire line of shirts for V4 that I consider to be a bit on the pricey side. But that's just my opinion.
it's what makes sales so exciting. :lol:
though, this year's antics with the pa sale ruined the joy for me this year, and i won't look forward to it next year. iz a bygone era.
Maybe I am wrong but I have the feeling that V4 items still sells a lot maybe even more than genesis items just by the fact that most poser users are stuck in V4. I feel pitty for them, well not really, I am very happy with G2 and the prices and if u become PC memeber prices are very resonable. For example is like the main figures pro bundles, I think very few people would buy for 125$ but with all discounts and specially PC memebers discounts they are about 40$ when released, add the conversion to € and I think is very good and fair price. Also there is lot of freebies and 2$ items wuch again converted to € is like buying a coffee in Europe.
To be honest, I buy a lot more on Renderosity than here these days. Why?
First, I am not buying things because they are cheap (on sale) and maybe I can use them some day. I only buy the things that I need. This leads to the next point.
Second, on Renderosity I have a bigger variety of products (my personal opinion for my needs) at (usually) lower prices.
And third, the TOS at Rendo allow a much closer look at the things you buy, which is also an important factor. Thats why the 30 day money back thing here at DAZ is so important. Most of the times you can only guess what is really possible with some of the outfits and you only see that after buying.
But we all have the freedom of choice, so everyone can do what he wants.
I am the opposite to you. I used to buy quite a lot from other sites, but just checked and the last time I actually purchased an item from Rend was almost a year ago, and yet just yesterday I bought 7 items from the DAZ 3D store + a freebie.
The most expensive thing I ever saw was at Rendo. It was listed at about $5000 if I remember correctly, for a new figure. Course it was a typo but still......
;-)
For me it is a bit like the opposite. I buy more at Daz store simply because for me personally the quality standard in the Daz store here is much, much higher and also the items sold here are more to my taste. Of course there are some specific vendors at other stores who produce very high quality as well and quite often it happens that those vendors are selling in the Daz store as a PA, too. Naturally, if a store has got a lower quality bar with regards to which products get sold then of course you have more "variety" so to say, but that is a form of variety I can very much live without.
As for the pricing here, I think it is fair, though it depends on the respective PA a bit. Some PAs do have a higher price tag, but quite often this goes along with a higher quality. Some PAs offer really great quality for low prices - I am not naming those PAs to not convince them to do it differently from now on :P. Also keep in mind the 30 day money-back guarantee and other services like support Daz offers, whereas at many other stores those 'services' have to be covered by the PAs themselves - and sometimes in a quite ridiculous manner. For older products I can see the point at times, they seem to be stuck at the original price they have been published, but usually you get good deals on about everything in the Daz store at specific sales and that is what I am aiming for.
So to sum it up: I am feeling rather comfy here in the Daz zone. Home sweet home! :)
I buy at other stores more than here also and for similar reasons, what i need, when i need it, better promos that show all the product, etc. Personally, while there is more variety at Rendo, the quality is all over the place and it seems they let anyone sell any item, unlike here where there is some consistency with quality.
this is a small market and I am all for as many stores as came make a buck, more variety means more options. The market will dictate the price, vote with your wallets.
It's funny, I can think of one vendor here that makes quality detailed outfits with detailed mesh, but charges way to much for a single item, no way for me to justify that price, yet due to the many sales here, I have quite a few of their items, As for buying older items, I constantly purchase older items for V4, even been buying older V3 stuff lately since it works on genesis really well.
With the sale that DAZ just had, the sale at RDNA, the sales at rendo and the sale at Xurge3D, my bank account is going down fast, LOL.
That depends what your value & benefit you are after....
DAZ Still offers biggest bang for my buck.
My budget puts $250/mo towards my content library. I have a "hobby" (small business operating at a loss) making 3d media publications - 3d games, 3d websites and Story Illustrations . Therefore I focus my purchased on content that can be licensed for games, and find content limited to only 2D representations too limiting for future use. Because 3d publishing licenses are available for DAZ Originals and RawArt, most of my library is made of this content. Therefore I get the most value (bang for the buck) with DAZ where about $180-200 is spent per month.
However I notice that as my library builds and purchasing options reduce at DAZ that I am looking at other sources. The sales and bundle promos accelerate catalog depletion rate enormously. :) Taking up the slack is easier now because recently Rendo adjusted their license terms and clarified how the content may be used in 3d (real-time) rendering publications and games without additional expense. Same with several other smaller 3d content vendors (like YURdigital), so I anticipate exploring other sources this winter. However - what I did not expect was Genesis 2. - Although it has been a budget buster this season because most DO - PC content will be developed for this going forward I took the plunge and in the bath too. HD does not interest me now, but I think it will keep the G2 content relevant well into the next decade as game engines (and asset obfuscation) technologies mature. Diversity and competition is a good thing, keeps technical advancements and creative energy flowing.
there was an item I bought at Poser Pros(i think that's what it was called) that was for Hiro 3 and David 3, I can't find the installer so I would definitely buy it again here if it was ever re-released, I know the chances of that happening are very unlikely but some items were ported over, it was very well done
I buy most of my items from http://www.daz3d.com/platinum-club-items
I buy the items that cost 1.99 and 2.99.
edited because I am half asleep. :D
No need to feel sorry for those of us who are "stuck" with V4/M4. We are quite happy where we are and with the figures themselves, not to mention that not everyone is technically "stuck" with those figures anyways. It is our choice and one we stand behind. Some of us have way too much money invested in those figures, not to mention time and work with characters, that we will not just simply leave them behind for the next big thing.
Don't feel sorry, just use the figure you prefer and create great art with them, that is what this is all about in the first place.
I have Genesis, the upgrades, and their packs and still I prefer the older figures over them. I just wished that Genesis could be better compatible with Poser and the older figures and all items without a big fuss over getting them to work. If that were the case, I would be more inclined to work with them.
As for the items themselves I just spent a good penny both here and at the other sites this month, most of that was on Gen 4 stuff, I did buy some of the Genesis morph packs and products but as for the clothes I bought one Genesis outfit plus texture pack and that was it. A couple hundred dollars on V4/M4 clothes and characters and just six dollars on Genesis. I have yet to buy any of the normal Genesis characters, the only ones I have purchased were Creatures, and when I got characters that are compatible with Genesis It also was compatible with V4 and looked better on that figure.
I think that the prices on V4/M4 items are high but I bought a bunch of them for a great deal in such a short time during all of these sales. Really I think the sites are spoiling us now actually. :)
On the topic of high prices, some Gen 3 items tend to be pretty high for their age. That's my opinion and all....
*Deleted my opinion about the idea of a Poser-native Genesis. I am not allowed to app bait.*
For the OP: Old PA products that are not on sale are going to look expensive, you bet. That's not the DAZ market as a whole, it's a function of how sales work here. As an earlier poster pointed out, old V3 products are often in the $20-$30 range! Further, using V4 places you in a specialty category here because that is no longer the mainstream figure for DS users (it is for Poser, but this is not a Poser-first marketplace). You just have to watch for sale prices on individual vendors' stores or on store categories that include the items you want. DAZ makes sure those things come up pretty frequently, and getting the newsletter also helps make sure you don't miss it. V4 products will be around for a long time because Genesis users can still use them.
Ok, without the app baiting, why would there be an issue with both a Poser and DS version of Genesis? This isn't an attempt to cause a conflict but the DSON importer had not proven to be the answer to the Genesis into Poser workflow.
Ok, without the app baiting, why would there be an issue with both a Poser and DS version of Genesis? This isn't an attempt to cause a conflict but the DSON importer had not proven to be the answer to the Genesis into Poser workflow.
I think the politest way to put this is that the features that make Genesis great are mostly DS-native features. Without smoothing and collision and/or a good autoconform or morph transfer, a megamorphing androgynous (or megamorphing split-base) figure is not that useful. With V4 and M4 a lot of the morphs that were made were never supported or able to be supported in Poser. Further, Poser has nothing like Autofit, thus negating another of the important features (the ability to easily use three generations of clothing, Gen 4, G1 and G2). Fitting Room is in no way the same thing, and believe me, neither is CrossDresser.
My more vehement remarks would be addressed to the necessity of engine-native clothing.
The Poser vs. DS Genesis has to do with different methods for weightmapping. Just look at dawn, which are two separate figures, separate meshes and separate clothes. Poser stuff 95% so far. For V4 I can still buy something that looks cool, even if it is "poser only" and fix the shaders (if needed and use it).
And For me, I've downed my Rendo purchases a lot the past year, only a few vendors there which I purchase from. I'm not really into Mini Tanga Set XXXVIII for V4, I really like what's arrived for M6 now, really high quality male clothes and in a varity of times. I just need someone making M6 versions of 30sMaleClothing and WorkingMan and a V6 version of 30s everyday dress and I'm happy, lol.
The first few years, I was buying stuff here at full price....I spent about $500
Then I started jumping on sales whenever they popped up....I spent about $1000
then joined PC....I spent about $20k!
NOT kidding!
But I do have about 20-30Gig of good quality stuff from here for almost nothing.
Rendosity & the other Rendo, not nearly as much--maybe about $100 each from them--but good quality stuff there, too.
But looking through Turbo--HOLY CRAP! :bug:
And most stuff there looks like crap & they STILL want $100s for it.
On top of that, you can find many works by the same artists elsewhere for next to nothing, but @ turbo, again, they STILL want $100s-$1000s for them--that, I don't understand.
I've only bought 3 items from there: 2 @ $1000 each & 1 @ $60, and ONLY because there was no other place to get them and I absolutely needed to get them.
The first few years, I was buying stuff here at full price....I spent about $500
Then I started jumping on sales whenever they popped up....I spent about $1000
then joined PC....I spent about $20k!
NOT kidding!
But I do have about 20-30Gig of good quality stuff from here.
Rendosity & the other Rendo, not nearly as much--maybe about $100 each from them--but good quality stuff there, too.
But looking through Turbo--HOLY CRAP! :bug:
And most stuff there looks like crap & they STILL want $100s for it.
On top of that, you can find many works by the same artists elsewhere for next to nothing, but @ turbo, again, they STILL want $100s-$1000s for them--that, I don't understand.
I've only bought 3 items from there: 2 @ $1000 each & 1 @ $60, and ONLY because there was no other place to get them and I absolutely needed to get them.
I've bought two things at TurboSquid, an 1930s film camera that went for $60, and an acorn (for the iKyoto renders, btw, anyone heard anything???) that went for $10, but I've seen some really expensive things there. One thing though, some of those grant you license to use the mesh in games, and many items are for 3D MAX and Cinema4D, so we're talking a different budget.
But I've spent countless dollars here at DAZ, I donät wanna know so happy the Product list don't have a "summary column" at the bottom.
I've bought models from Turbo in the past, not cheapo ones either, they were around the $30-50 bracket.... there were not great I have to say, triangulated, horrible Boolean cuts, uv's and smoothing groups in a bit of a mess.
Only ever downloaded freebies from Turbo since then, and to be honest, Share Cg has better offerings in that department.
I've bought two things at TurboSquid, an 1930s film camera that went for $60, and an acorn (for the iKyoto renders, btw, anyone heard anything???) that went for $10, but I've seen some really expensive things there. One thing though, some of those grant you license to use the mesh in games, and many items are for 3D MAX and Cinema4D, so we're talking a different budget.
But I've spent countless dollars here at DAZ, I donät wanna know so happy the Product list don't have a "summary column" at the bottom.So true.
But even with the licensing being the issue, you can get tons of stuff at Rendo (& most link to CGShare) for free to use comercially & redistribute (with all files intact) are way better quality than most at Turbo that you have to pay for. Most stuff here at DAZ that's allowed to use commercially can only be done in renders/animations--but still! Much less $!
But if you ever do want to know how much, you need to open the My Orders tab :coolgrin:
Price and quality are going to be hit or miss no matter where you go. Every site I have been to and bought from or grabbed freebies, is a juggling act to make sure I get as much bang for my buck as possible. You want top quality for the least amount of money...the only way to get that is to shop around. Every place has both high and low prices, good and poor quality. You can't say one place is more so then another, as I have seen all of them in the same light depending on the time of year, economical plights and even high times. People need to live and 3D is a way to make a little extra to help with that. Each will decide their price depending on their financial situation and what they need to live, that includes the companies, such as Daz.
Edit: Flip note...you never need to absolutely buy anything. There are enough paid and free programs and content out there and tutorials and not to mention lots of people who help that anyone can make what they need these days. Everyone has the potential to become a modeller, you just need to actually do the work,which many seem to not want to do, yet will complain about price if someone else does the work. Some charge a lot, some charge nothing, then there is the in-between prices. People need to either stop being lazy or stop complaining. Those who know how to make things, yet guard their secrets, need to stop being selfish with their knowledge and actually help others who want to learn. Before anyone jumps on me for that statement, I know for a fact, here and other places, there are artists who could help and don't because they fear the competition that might result.
Every item you see took hours, sometime weeks or months to make. For many of the creators, this is their livelihood. Many require expensive software (take a look at the price of Z-Brush. Unless I win the lottery, I'll never own it.) It takes more than a basic computer to do efficient 3D work. When you buy an item for $10, the artist is getting maybe $5. That's small change for a lot of work.
I was looking for some medical equipment not available in the usual market places. Found them on a couple of European sites for $35-40 each. For an object with no rigging and very basic textures. Try to appreciate what you get, and think about the creator. When you find a good sale, try to buy more of his/her work.
concur, however ZBrush is only priced in the 3 digits ($700) some 3d app suites like ones from Autodesk are near 10x that cost! neat $7,000!
TurboSquid is aimed at a completely different market from ours. Their clients are pro or semi-pro, and in many cases the cost is passed on to the end client, so price isn't an issue. Also, they may need the files in other formats for direct use in 3d Max or Lightwave, so it's a whole different ballgame (And if anyone remembers the notorious $100 baseball, that could be considered a pun - lol).
To a large degree, prices are set according to the market you sell in, and the hobbyist market is extremely lucky in many ways. Apart from very low prices, there's also a huge choice of almost every item you could want - far more than you'll find at TS for most genres.
Btw, the DAZ gaming license is available for every PA product in the store - if the PA wants to sell for a game. All you need to do is contact the PA and ask. They'll fix it up with DAZ for you.
mac
I agree TS is more like a "stock" media service with no standardization however format customization is available on request.
WRT to DAZ Gaming License available, while we can request special license to publish in 3d, its really not practical because project design and implementation planning works better with having viability variables up front. Too many dependent decisions to request license availability and cost per item. To maximize sales, its crucial to be able to publish availability and costs up front unless a full catalog is available behind the counter on demand with the pricing that could make decisions efficient.
Also I NEVER GET a logical answer to this: - Why dont more PA's offer game publishing license options? I cant see any more risk or exposure to piriating so why after incurring product development costs, are they not maximizing the sales opportunities??
Why the shhhh... about publishing 3d in 3d? Why is there no DAZ FAQ telling people how they can take advantage of all the cool technologies emerging to this end? RealLusion begining to exploit teh concept now however only to Unity users which is just the tip of the iceberg where the base is in real-time social media MMPGs emerging.